"Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
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06-09-2015, 04:41 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 04:07 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(06-09-2015 03:56 PM)unfogged Wrote:  You trying to un-derail this travesty or something?
Consider

Perish the thought.

Excuse me, do you have a moment to talk about our lord and savior?
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I try to behave. Heart

Well, she does have much better fashion sense than Jesus. If Tim Gunn can be the Holy Spirit--I'm converting to the religion of the Gwynnie!

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06-09-2015, 04:47 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 04:41 PM)jennybee Wrote:  Well, she does have much better fashion sense than Jesus. If Tim Gunn can be the Holy Spirit--I'm converting to the religion of the Gwynnie!

*Gwynnite.

Holy Spirit is an undefined variable - undefinable by its very nature. Pops seems to continually miss that little factoid.

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06-09-2015, 05:09 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Who can you discern the lagitimacy of what I consider indisputable to self? You can't. It's like using everyone else's perspective to refuse mine even though their general perspective folds right into mine.

You just do not get it. What you believe is irrelevant if you can't demonstrate that it is true. There is absolutely no reason for anybody to accept anything you say.

Quote:Lightning is plasma and has little to do with my initial question. Plasma isn't traditionally physical though.

Every time I think you can't get any more wrong you surprise me.

Quote:As far as emotion, thought, and chemical reactions in the brain are conserned;
There is a lot of evidence to show that emotion precedes cognition too, but emotions occur in response to stimuli. So it is exposure to emotionally valenced stimuli that causes chemical reactions, from the most basic; activity in the reticular activating system, to higher limbic areas e.g. the left amygdala, the medial thalamus the anterior cingulate gyrus and so-on and activity in these areas results in emotion, which in turn influences higher, more volitional cognitive processes.

All this happens very quickly. Exposure to emotionally valenced information has been shown to alter people's emotional-motivational state within 250 milliseconds. It has also been shown to happen outside people's conscious awareness as the response occurs even though the stimulus exposure time (40 milliseconds) is less than a person can consciously register (see for example Chen, M., & Bargh, J. A. (1999). Consequences of automatic evaluation: Immediate behavioral predispositions to approach or avoid the stimulus. Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 25 (2), 215-224.).

Nothing about that supports anything except thoughts and emotions being based in the physical brain. Thank you for demonstrating that you don't understand what you read.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
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06-09-2015, 05:38 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Who can you discern the lagitimacy of what I consider indisputable to self? You can't.

By comparing what you say to what is demonstrably true.

It's not hard.

(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Plasma isn't traditionally physical though.

I will treasure this moment in the years to come. It is rare that I see someone so blatantly, utterly, unashamedly wrong about something.

(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  As far as emotion, thought, and chemical reactions in the brain are conserned;
There is a lot of evidence to show that emotion precedes cognition too, but emotions occur in response to stimuli. So it is exposure to emotionally valenced stimuli that causes chemical reactions, from the most basic; activity in the reticular activating system, to higher limbic areas e.g. the left amygdala, the medial thalamus the anterior cingulate gyrus and so-on and activity in these areas results in emotion, which in turn influences higher, more volitional cognitive processes.

You don't understand what a single one of those words means, do you?

(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  All this happens very quickly. Exposure to emotionally valenced information has been shown to alter people's emotional-motivational state within 250 milliseconds. It has also been shown to happen outside people's conscious awareness as the response occurs even though the stimulus exposure time (40 milliseconds) is less than a person can consciously register (see for example Chen, M., & Bargh, J. A. (1999). Consequences of automatic evaluation: Immediate behavioral predispositions to approach or avoid the stimulus. Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 25 (2), 215-224.).

And precisely none of this demonstrates in any way that emotions are anything other than neurochemical reactions occurring in the brain.

(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  This game is getting boring. Do you have another? Perhaps one with a point, or meaning that doesn't loop right back to ignorance.

Oh, it's your game, sirrah. I am just along for the ride.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
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06-09-2015, 06:52 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
Unbeliever,

I am done with your cut and paste, out of context, ring around the rosy bs for now. Not playing last word wins with you. So feel free to reply or not.

It states that emotions are both the cause and effect of cognitive thought and the chemical changes, but that emotion leads to further, more complex thought in cases. But whatever.

If it is mine then it isn't a game and will eventually prove to be of the utmost significance in relation to existence as we think we know it.
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06-09-2015, 07:03 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 04:38 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Plasma isn't traditionally physical though.

This statement approaches fractal wrongness.

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06-09-2015, 07:19 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
No Ass, what you don't get is that everything isn't specifically physical and therefore cannot be accurately described or testified to in strict, physical or material terms. This pertains to the four dimensions. How can you say that there are but four because that's all we perceive? Even if there where but four our limited understanding of the fourth is of such that literally allows for all I say under God. It is only some anger or greed that keeps you from accepting the mere possibility of God. Let alone all the signs and support from diverse positions, including science, and truthful self.

Still no one answers anything and accomplishes nothing in favor of misplaced pride.

Sorry you can't read correctly. I already answered that as the guote supports exactly what I initially stated.

Perhaps you aren't aware, but it the first few items that are pulled on a web search may be paid for, henceforth bought. Biased for you silly fuckers.
It's amazing how some are exactly how you are supposed to be.

Thanks.
Good luck, really.
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06-09-2015, 07:19 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 06:52 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  It states that emotions are both the cause and effect of cognitive thought and the chemical changes, but that emotion leads to further, more complex thought in cases.

So some thoughts lead to other thoughts, yes.

It's still nothing more than chemical reactions in the brain.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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06-09-2015, 07:20 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 07:19 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  No Ass, what you don't get is that everything isn't specifically physical and therefore cannot be accurately described or testified to in strict, physical or material terms.

You have yet to present an example of something that can't.

(06-09-2015 07:19 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  It is only some anger or greed that keeps you from accepting the mere possibility of God.

No, it's the fact that the concept is rather silly, incoherent, and unsupported.

Anger is unnecessary. Rationality suffices.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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06-09-2015, 07:35 PM
RE: "Should you push aside your atheism for a few moments?"
(06-09-2015 07:19 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(06-09-2015 06:52 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  It states that emotions are both the cause and effect of cognitive thought and the chemical changes, but that emotion leads to further, more complex thought in cases.

So some thoughts lead to other thoughts, yes.

It's still nothing more than chemical reactions in the brain.
Emotion is the energy that starts conscious thought. Reflection, introspectively, through our conscience allows for real direction, energy and meaning behind thought. This leads to more energy and more developed thought. Emotions not only cause conscious thought and visa versa, the chemical reactions allow for further focused emotion or conscious thought in a productive manner.
None of this is physical. However it releases physical chemicals that make you have further emotions that are to be obvious indicators of direction, much like nerves and pain in that regard. In that they are equipped in us to guide us. The point was, initially, I believe, that emotions do cause the chemicals that are dispersed into the brain, and visa versa. Thanks.
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