Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
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06-02-2014, 04:07 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2014 04:12 PM by Free.)
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
Okay, this is for Alla.

Here is the Question:

Q: So why did Jesus tell the Pharisee that the Christ would not come from the lineage of King David?

Firstly, you learn to understand the philosophy of Jesus, and we will do that with his very own words from the Gospel accounts. Firstly, I will ask some questions, and then use Jesus' own words to answer the questions:

Q: What is God?

A: Joh_4:24 God is a spirit, and they who worship Him must worship in spirit and in truth.

So according to Jesus, God is a spirit. I'm sure we can agree on this. Now, the next question.

Q: Can a Spirit give birth to a flesh man?

A: Joh_3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.


Again, according to Jesus, God is a spirit, and the Spirit gives birth to spirit, and not flesh.

Now here's the BIG Question:

Q: What is the Christ?

A: In numerous places through the gospel records we can find that the Christ is the Son of God.

Q: If God is a Spirit, and the Spirit gives birth to Spirit, then would the Son of God be flesh, or would he be a spirit?

A: The Son of God would be a spirit, whom we regard as Christ.

Q: Can the Christ be a descendant of a flesh man known as King David?

A: No, because flesh gives birth to flesh, and the Spirit gives birth to Spirit. Since God is a spirit, then the Son of God must also be a spirit.


You see Alla, Jesus the physical man may indeed have come from the lineage of King David, but the Christ pre-existed King David, and according to the philosophy of Jesus, the Christ is immortal and eternal.

And that is exactly why Jesus said to the Pharisee that the Christ could not possibly come from the lineage of King David. Also, it is the very same reason that Jesus- speaking in the spirit of Christ- also said the following:

Joh_8:58 Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham came into being, I AM!

If you look very closely at the scriptures you will often see Jesus saying such things as "The Son of Man" and also "The Son of God." Here are some of those examples:

Mat_8:20 And Jesus said to him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head.

Joh_12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour has come that the Son of Man should be glorified.


Once again, the example above show Jesus- speaking in the spirit of Christ- talking about the son of man, which means his physical person.

Jesus often speaks about his physical person, The Son of Man, and of his spiritual nature known as Christ, in which he believes is the Son of God

Remember now, Jesus asked, "The Christ, who's son is he?" He was not talking about a physical man, but a spiritual being who Jesus believed was the Son of God.

According to Jesus, the Son of God was not born of man, nor comes from King David. The Son of God- the Christ- is a spirit that has always existed eternally.

And now you know why Jesus said that the Christ was not a descendant of King David.

But I think you already knew this, but did not realize what I was meaning.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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06-02-2014, 04:16 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:07 PM)Free Wrote:  Okay, this is for Alla.

Here is the Question:

Q: So why did Jesus tell the Pharisee that the Christ would not come from the lineage of King David?
I don't know whom did He say this? Could you please provide book, chapter, verse?
I will respond to the rest later.

English is not my native language.
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06-02-2014, 04:25 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2014 04:31 PM by Free.)
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:16 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:07 PM)Free Wrote:  Okay, this is for Alla.

Here is the Question:

Q: So why did Jesus tell the Pharisee that the Christ would not come from the lineage of King David?
I don't know whom did He say this? Could you please provide book, chapter, verse?
I will respond to the rest later.

I will show you several examples:


Mar 12:35 And answering, teaching in the temple, Jesus said, How do the scribes say that Christ is the Son of David?
Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Spirit: "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Mar 12:37 David therefore himself calls Him Lord, and why then is He his son? And the great crowd heard Him gladly.

Luk 20:41 And He said to them, How do they say that Christ is the Son of David?
Luk 20:42 Even David himself says in the Book of Psalms, "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand
Luk 20:43 until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Luk 20:44 David then calls Him Lord; how then is He his son?

Mat 22:41 While the Pharisees were gathered, Jesus asked them,
Mat 22:42 saying, What do you think of Christ? Whose son is he? They say to Him, David's.
Mat 22:43 He said to them, How then does David by the Spirit call him Lord, saying,
Mat 22:44 "the LORD said to my Lord, Sit on My right until I make Your enemies Your footstool for Your feet?"
Mat 22:45 If David then calls Him Lord, how is He his son?
Mat 22:46 And no one was able to answer Him a word, nor did anyone dare from that day to question Him any more.

As you can see, in all 3 Gospels Jesus challenged the Pharisee's belief that the Christ would be a son of David; a descendant. In ancient Judaism, it would impossible for the Christ to be a "son" or descendant of King David if King David calls the Christ "Lord."

The very scripture of King David shows you that the Christ existed during King David's time, otherwise, King David would not have said, "The LORD said to my Lord ..." Therefore, since the very scripture from King David demonstrates that Christ already existed when King David lived, how then could the Christ be a descendant of King David?

What Jesus is telling you is that the Christ is lord and master of King David, which means the Christ cannot be a descendant.

Do you understand now?

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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06-02-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:07 PM)Free Wrote:  Okay, this is for Alla.

Here is the Question:

Q: So why did Jesus tell the Pharisee that the Christ would not come from the lineage of King David?

Firstly, you learn to understand the philosophy of Jesus, and we will do that with his very own words from the Gospel accounts. Firstly, I will ask some questions, and then use Jesus' own words to answer the questions:

Q: What is God?

A: Joh_4:24 God is a spirit, and they who worship Him must worship in spirit and in truth.

So according to Jesus, God is a spirit. I'm sure we can agree on this. Now, the next question.

Q: Can a Spirit give birth to a flesh man?

A: Joh_3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.


Again, according to Jesus, God is a spirit, and the Spirit gives birth to spirit, and not flesh.

Now here's the BIG Question:

Q: What is the Christ?

A: In numerous places through the gospel records we can find that the Christ is the Son of God.

Q: If God is a Spirit, and the Spirit gives birth to Spirit, then would the Son of God be flesh, or would he be a spirit?

A: The Son of God would be a spirit, whom we regard as Christ.

Q: Can the Christ be a descendant of a flesh man known as King David?

A: No, because flesh gives birth to flesh, and the Spirit gives birth to Spirit. Since God is a spirit, then the Son of God must also be a spirit.


You see Alla, Jesus the physical man may indeed have come from the lineage of King David, but the Christ pre-existed King David, and according to the philosophy of Jesus, the Christ is immortal and eternal.

And that is exactly why Jesus said to the Pharisee that the Christ could not possibly come from the lineage of King David. Also, it is the very same reason that Jesus- speaking in the spirit of Christ- also said the following:

Joh_8:58 Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham came into being, I AM!

If you look very closely at the scriptures you will often see Jesus saying such things as "The Son of Man" and also "The Son of God." Here are some of those examples:

Mat_8:20 And Jesus said to him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head.

Joh_12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour has come that the Son of Man should be glorified.


Once again, the example above show Jesus- speaking in the spirit of Christ- talking about the son of man, which means his physical person.

Jesus often speaks about his physical person, The Son of Man, and of his spiritual nature known as Christ, in which he believes is the Son of God

Remember now, Jesus asked, "The Christ, who's son is he?" He was not talking about a physical man, but a spiritual being who Jesus believed was the Son of God.

According to Jesus, the Son of God was not born of man, nor comes from King David. The Son of God- the Christ- is a spirit that has always existed eternally.

And now you know why Jesus said that the Christ was not a descendant of King David.

But I think you already knew this, but did not realize what I was meaning.
Free, your analysis is very logical and very intelligent.
And it is correct only if we assume that spirits can not have flesh.
God is Spirit, but so do you. You are spirit which has physical body of flesh and bones and blood.
Spirits can have physical bodies. God Heavenly Father is Spirit which has glorified body of flesh and bones. Jesus Christ is Spirit but when He came on earth He obtained mortal physical body. Then He died - separation of Spirit and flesh. Then He was resurrected - re-union of Spirit and flesh.
Jesus ascended to heaven in glorified body "flesh and bones". And this is kind of body GOD Heavenly Father has.
Christ's mother was mortal woman with body- flesh, bones and BLOOD. Christ's Father is God Elohim Who is Spirit with glorified tangible body of flesh and bones, but NOT blood.
There are spirits that don't have physical bodies. They are:
1)all those who are not born here on earth yet
2)all who died and wait for resurrection
3)Devil and his demons

There are spirits who have physical bodies:
1) mortals like you or me
2)resurrected beings like Heavenly Father and like Christ.

English is not my native language.
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06-02-2014, 04:38 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:25 PM)Free Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:16 PM)Alla Wrote:  I don't know whom did He say this? Could you please provide book, chapter, verse?
I will respond to the rest later.

I will show you several examples:


Mar 12:35 And answering, teaching in the temple, Jesus said, How do the scribes say that Christ is the Son of David?
Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Spirit: "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Mar 12:37 David therefore himself calls Him Lord, and why then is He his son? And the great crowd heard Him gladly.

Luk 20:41 And He said to them, How do they say that Christ is the Son of David?
Luk 20:42 Even David himself says in the Book of Psalms, "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand
Luk 20:43 until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Luk 20:44 David then calls Him Lord; how then is He his son?

Mat 22:41 While the Pharisees were gathered, Jesus asked them,
Mat 22:42 saying, What do you think of Christ? Whose son is he? They say to Him, David's.
Mat 22:43 He said to them, How then does David by the Spirit call him Lord, saying,
Mat 22:44 "the LORD said to my Lord, Sit on My right until I make Your enemies Your footstool for Your feet?"
Mat 22:45 If David then calls Him Lord, how is He his son?
Mat 22:46 And no one was able to answer Him a word, nor did anyone dare from that day to question Him any more.

As you can see, in all 3 Gospels Jesus challenged the Pharisee's belief that the Christ would be a son of David; a descendant. In ancient Judaism, it would impossible for the Christ to be a "son" or descendant of King David if King David calls the Christ "Lord."

The very scripture of King David shows you that the Christ existed during King David's time, otherwise, King David would not have said, "The LORD said to my Lord ..." Therefore, since the very scripture from King David demonstrates that Christ already existed when King David lived, how then could the Christ be a descendant of King David?

What Jesus is telling you is that the Christ is lord and master of King David, which means the Christ cannot be a descendant.

Do you understand now?
Yes, I understand. And I agreed that it is very intelligent interpretation. It can be correct interpretation.
So Pharisees believed that Christ is son of David. That's all. They didn't believe that
Christ is MORE then just son of David. It is more important to believe that Christ is God then to believe that Christ is son of David.
By asking them why David called Christ "Lord" He was trying to show them that Christ is Lord or God FIRST.

English is not my native language.
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06-02-2014, 04:45 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:25 PM)Free Wrote:  The very scripture of King David shows you that the Christ existed during King David's time, otherwise, King David would not have said, "The LORD said to my Lord ..." Therefore, since the very scripture from King David demonstrates that Christ already existed when King David lived, how then could the Christ be a descendant of King David?[/b]
the same way you are descendent of your ancestors. You existed before you came to this earth. You lived with Christ before you were born. You are spirit Son of God the same way Jesus Christ is spirit Son of God.
But spirits come here on earth to obtain physical body, experience mortality, learn good and evil and be tested. Jesus Christ came here at His time you came here at your time. Christ had His mission you have your mission on earth.
We are all spirit children of God Elohim.
Jesus Christ(Jehovah) is our God and our Brother and Creator of this earth. Elohim is our God and Father of our spirits.

English is not my native language.
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06-02-2014, 04:47 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:38 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:25 PM)Free Wrote:  I will show you several examples:


Mar 12:35 And answering, teaching in the temple, Jesus said, How do the scribes say that Christ is the Son of David?
Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Spirit: "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Mar 12:37 David therefore himself calls Him Lord, and why then is He his son? And the great crowd heard Him gladly.

Luk 20:41 And He said to them, How do they say that Christ is the Son of David?
Luk 20:42 Even David himself says in the Book of Psalms, "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand
Luk 20:43 until I place Your enemies as Your footstool."
Luk 20:44 David then calls Him Lord; how then is He his son?

Mat 22:41 While the Pharisees were gathered, Jesus asked them,
Mat 22:42 saying, What do you think of Christ? Whose son is he? They say to Him, David's.
Mat 22:43 He said to them, How then does David by the Spirit call him Lord, saying,
Mat 22:44 "the LORD said to my Lord, Sit on My right until I make Your enemies Your footstool for Your feet?"
Mat 22:45 If David then calls Him Lord, how is He his son?
Mat 22:46 And no one was able to answer Him a word, nor did anyone dare from that day to question Him any more.

As you can see, in all 3 Gospels Jesus challenged the Pharisee's belief that the Christ would be a son of David; a descendant. In ancient Judaism, it would impossible for the Christ to be a "son" or descendant of King David if King David calls the Christ "Lord."

The very scripture of King David shows you that the Christ existed during King David's time, otherwise, King David would not have said, "The LORD said to my Lord ..." Therefore, since the very scripture from King David demonstrates that Christ already existed when King David lived, how then could the Christ be a descendant of King David?

What Jesus is telling you is that the Christ is lord and master of King David, which means the Christ cannot be a descendant.

Do you understand now?
Yes, I understand. And I agreed that it is very intelligent interpretation. It can be correct interpretation.
So Pharisees believed that Christ is son of David. That's all. They didn't believe that
Christ is MORE then just son of David. It is more important to believe that Christ is God then to believe that Christ is son of David.
By asking them why David called Christ "Lord" He was trying to show them that Christ is Lord or God FIRST.

The Pharisee, the Jews, and even Christians today believe that the Christ would be a physical man. However, according to the very uttered words of Jesus, the Christ is not a man.

The Christ is a spirit, son of God. The Christ existed before mankind, and before Jesus was ever born.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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06-02-2014, 04:52 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:47 PM)Free Wrote:  The Pharisee, the Jews, and even Christians today believe that the Christ would be a physical man. However, according to the very uttered words of Jesus, the Christ is not a man.
very confusing. Christ or God is physical Man.
God is Man with glorified physical body of flesh and bones. But there is a Spirit in this body.

(06-02-2014 04:47 PM)Free Wrote:  The Christ is a spirit, son of God. The Christ existed before mankind, and before Jesus was ever born.
Yes, Jesus, existed before this earth was created. So do we. It was our choice to come here.

English is not my native language.
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06-02-2014, 05:00 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 04:52 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 04:47 PM)Free Wrote:  The Pharisee, the Jews, and even Christians today believe that the Christ would be a physical man. However, according to the very uttered words of Jesus, the Christ is not a man.
very confusing. Christ or God is physical Man.
God is Man with glorified physical body of flesh and bones. But there is a Spirit in this body.

(06-02-2014 04:47 PM)Free Wrote:  The Christ is a spirit, son of God. The Christ existed before mankind, and before Jesus was ever born.
Yes, Jesus, existed before this earth was created. So do we. It was our choice to come here.

What I am saying is that people worship a man named Jesus, instead of Christ. They do not understand.

They do not know the difference because of the religion of Christianity, which Christ and Jesus have absolutely nothing to do with. Christianity does not teach the philosophy of Christ.

Christianity teaches the philosophy of the Apostle Paul, not of Christ.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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06-02-2014, 05:46 PM
RE: Shouldn't there be more Christians with eye patches?
(06-02-2014 05:00 PM)Free Wrote:  What I am saying is that people worship a man named Jesus, instead of Christ. They do not understand.
Jesus is the Christ. This is what Scriptures testify.

(06-02-2014 05:00 PM)Free Wrote:  They do not know the difference because of the religion of Christianity, which Christ and Jesus have absolutely nothing to do with. Christianity does not teach the philosophy of Christ.
What is philosophy of Christ? Who is the Christ according to your understanding of the Scriptures?
Christianity has many creeds. They teach philosophies of men mingled with Scriptures.

(06-02-2014 05:00 PM)Free Wrote:  Christianity teaches the philosophy of the Apostle Paul, not of Christ.
What is philosophy of Paul? Or what is the main difference between philosophy of Paul and philosophy of Christ?
P.S. Please tell me only if you want to have this debate.

English is not my native language.
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