Slavery Debate with Pastor
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15-09-2016, 01:40 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
This is the last message I plan to send to Tom. I'm so very sickened by his words and his twisted ramblings that I cannot continue. I give him the last word so I'll post whatever he sends.

Thanks for the input, folks!



Tom,

You said you prefer ESV so here it is: “When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money.”

Tom, when you wrote “You still owe him your life, if you take it, even if it takes him 5 days to die.” you are in direct conflict with “But if the slave survives a day or two (and then dies, is the implication), he is not to be avenged,”

=========

“Funny thing about the eventual path to us not killing each other. It only took a few days after God explicitly said, “thou shalt not kill” for us to stop.”

So we’ve stopped? We don’t kill each other anymore? Somebody alert CNN, we don’t kill each other anymore!

=========

You’re talking about “distinctions in the way we apply labor and tax law between citizens and immigrants” and trying to draw some parallel between that and slavery? That’s silly, Tom. And it cheapens the suffering of actual slaves. How dare you?

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“Or do you mean if I lost everything I own and became an unemployable, homeless charity case? I would hope someone out there had read Leviticus 25:35 and following so I can get back on my feet. “

Are you Jewish, Tom? Because that passage is for the Hebrews, not us.

=========

You see, that’s the difference between you and me I guess. I’d like to see those Burmese refugees have ALL of the protections of a kind and loving god who EXPLICITLY stated in no uncertain terms that to own other humans is FORBIDDEN. Full stop. But instead, this god character weasels around with different scenarios about who you can own, for how long, how you can beat them, and then adds a loophole so even his chosen people can be owned as property forever.

=========

Tom, if you believe for a second that slavery would still be as rampant and awful as it was in our own recent past and still is in some parts of the world, were it not for your bible then I can only chalk that up to the fact that you yourslf have voluntarily delivered yourself into slavery to your god.

What other conclusion can be drawn other than you enjoy the masochism of slavery, revel in and celebrate it actually, and therefore will sell out your own sense of humanity and basic decency in order to prop up the horrible book that has contributed so much to the advancement of slavery throughout history?

I weep for you, Tom, I truly weep for you. Yours is a lost mind and I only wish you would at least stop recruiting others, especially innocent children, into your awful, awful dungeon of slavery to your terrible god.

My only consolation is the certainty that your book is merely a collection of barbaric mythology and more minds will free themselves in this indeed great dawn of secularism and humanism.


You have failed miserably in defending your beliefs again, Tom. I will not ask anymore of you.

I’ve been pretty hard on you in this discussion, so you get the last word. Lash out at me or forgive me (as you’re commanded to do!).


Best,

J


P.S. In spite of some of the things you’ve said, I still think you’re probably better than your religion.
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15-09-2016, 02:36 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/in...avery.html

Don't Live each day like it's your last. Live each day like you have 541 days after that one where every choice you make will have lasting implications to you and the world around you. ~ Tim Minchin
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15-09-2016, 02:44 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
(13-09-2016 07:05 AM)KerimF Wrote:  Sorry, isn't this Pastor Jewish, practically speaking?

I mean, he is interested almost solely in what was addressed to the ancient Jews (the kids of humanity) though the updated teachings, provided by Jesus to the adults of humanity, supersede and go beyond all previous ones on the Old Testament.

Kerim

Perchance you could look up the definition of Jewish.
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15-09-2016, 02:50 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
Can someone explain to me what the fuck "kids of humanity means" in relation to the Jews? KerimF seems to have to point this out every time he mentions Jews.
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15-09-2016, 02:54 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
(15-09-2016 02:36 PM)Commonsensei Wrote:  http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/in...avery.html

The bible can be used to condemn and justify slavery, but that's the really sinister aspect of it, because when it can be used either way, then it's up to humans providing justification for or condemnation of an morally abhorrent act based upon a pretense of "god says".

This has been the story of slavery since humans have walked the planet- domination of a person against their wishes, religion has simply served as a justification for it.

Who are we kidding here? If you obey religious dogma, you become a slave to that ideology. I find this morally objectionable on it's face, religion is a club for slavery, you voluntarily put those chains on your ankles when you accept it.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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15-09-2016, 02:56 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
Ya see these crazy kids with signs saying God hates fags. Maybe a couple of hundred years ago people should have carried signs saying God hates slave owners!
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15-09-2016, 08:56 PM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
Delusions are painful to watch. I think what you said was good but some minds are too twisted and full of confirmation bias to be reached at one time. The best you can hope for is that some seeds will be planted and he can snap out of his daydream.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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16-09-2016, 01:01 AM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
Bigjay,

your closing statements were the best i have seen in a long time. Bowing

Ceterum censeo, religionem delendam esse
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16-09-2016, 02:07 AM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
(15-09-2016 01:33 PM)bigjay Wrote:  The bible calls it slavery, but what else might you call an institution designed to provide shelter and work to people who have lost everything through misfortune or war or stupidity, with term limits (if you're Jewish), wage equivalencies (for all), and equal protection under the law, people who today would be placed in concentration camps and refugee camps and prisons, or under the overpasses in Nashville?

Facepalm So... *involuntary* servitude, possibly including sexual slavery, is ancient world socialism. This pastor dude of yours is a special kind of special.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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16-09-2016, 02:15 AM
RE: Slavery Debate with Pastor
(16-09-2016 02:07 AM)morondog Wrote:  Facepalm So... *involuntary* servitude, possibly including sexual slavery, is ancient world socialism. This pastor dude of yours is a special kind of special.

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