Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
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27-05-2016, 05:46 AM (This post was last modified: 27-05-2016 07:33 AM by RobbyPants.)
Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
Governor Snyder asked to end internal investigations of Flint water crisis

So, apparently the Snyder administration had the state police conduct their own civil investigations into the Flint water crisis all while criminal investigations are proceeding. The state police told officials they needed to answer questions or they could be fired.

The problem is, Garrity rights allow officials to remain silent, and if they are forced to talk, it can be found their fifth amendment rights against self-incrimination were violated. This effectively can give them immunity for things they were forced to say. What is puzzling is that the state police should be well aware of these rights as they apply to them, as government officials.

So, we have a bunch of people who might now be immune to prosecution because of a civil investigation running at the same time. Whether this is a case of incompetence with the right hand not knowing what the left is doing, or deliberate malfeasance to sabotage an investigation is an exercise left to the reader.

This clusterfuck keeps getting better and better.
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27-05-2016, 09:31 AM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
(27-05-2016 05:46 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Governor Snyder asked to end internal investigations of Flint water crisis

So, apparently the Snyder administration had the state police conduct their own civil investigations into the Flint water crisis all while criminal investigations are proceeding. The state police told officials they needed to answer questions or they could be fired.

The problem is, Garrity rights allow officials to remain silent, and if they are forced to talk, it can be found their fifth amendment rights against self-incrimination were violated. This effectively can give them immunity for things they were forced to say. What is puzzling is that the state police should be well aware of these rights as they apply to them, as government officials.

So, we have a bunch of people who might now be immune to prosecution because of a civil investigation running at the same time. Whether this is a case of incompetence with the right hand not knowing what the left is doing, or deliberate malfeasance to sabotage an investigation is an exercise left to the reader.

This clusterfuck keeps getting better and better.

But you have to keep in mind -- Flint is like a rusty old car that the owner neglected and never maintained..... The State Government is like the last mechanic who got forced to work on it...


Flint was clusterfucked long before the Snyder administration came along....


The State just got caught holding the bag.

.......................................

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27-05-2016, 10:47 AM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
(27-05-2016 05:46 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Governor Snyder asked to end internal investigations of Flint water crisis

So, apparently the Snyder administration had the state police conduct their own civil investigations into the Flint water crisis all while criminal investigations are proceeding. The state police told officials they needed to answer questions or they could be fired.

The problem is, Garrity rights allow officials to remain silent, and if they are forced to talk, it can be found their fifth amendment rights against self-incrimination were violated. This effectively can give them immunity for things they were forced to say. What is puzzling is that the state police should be well aware of these rights as they apply to them, as government officials.

So, we have a bunch of people who might now be immune to prosecution because of a civil investigation running at the same time. Whether this is a case of incompetence with the right hand not knowing what the left is doing, or deliberate malfeasance to sabotage an investigation is an exercise left to the reader.

This clusterfuck keeps getting better and better.

[Emphasis added -- Thump]

Well, I think the thing is that the prosecution cannot used the forced admissions against them in the case, but can still prosecute based on other evidence. IANAL, etc.
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27-05-2016, 11:13 AM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
That's exactly right. It means those statements can't be used against them. It's not an immunity from prosecution.

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27-05-2016, 11:19 AM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
Well, it's not as bad as I thought, then.
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27-05-2016, 12:58 PM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
(27-05-2016 09:31 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  But you have to keep in mind -- Flint is like a rusty old car that the owner neglected and never maintained..... The State Government is like the last mechanic who got forced to work on it...


Flint was clusterfucked long before the Snyder administration came along....


The State just got caught holding the bag.

Sorry, that's just not true. It was the state's requirement they switch to a cheaper water supply and the state was warned this would happen unless they treated the water. And, they didn't. This problem was both known and preventable and the state government ignored the issues.

That the city of Flint has been mismanaged is not any kind of defense to first putting lead filled water into their taps and then burying the evidence and threatening people who come forward to report the problem.

People should be facing prison time for this fiasco.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
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27-05-2016, 01:26 PM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
Flint may well have been utterly fucked before all this - but not poisoned and fucked.
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27-05-2016, 02:35 PM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
(27-05-2016 12:58 PM)BnW Wrote:  Sorry, that's just not true. It was the state's requirement they switch to a cheaper water supply and the state was warned this would happen unless they treated the water. And, they didn't. This problem was both known and preventable and the state government ignored the issues.

That the city of Flint has been mismanaged is not any kind of defense to first putting lead filled water into their taps and then burying the evidence and threatening people who come forward to report the problem.

People should be facing prison time for this fiasco.

It's even worse than that. There are claims that Snyder deliberately gave Nestle (who owns several bottled water brands) rights to the fresh water supply that was kept unavailable to the citizens of the city... it just so happens that his wife works for that company as their Michigan spokesperson. Now, the Nestle company is trying to save face by "donating" (I use irony-indicating quotation marks because they're being paid by others who are raising money for Flint relief) the bottled water back to the city! An excerpt from the article linked below:

The governor’s office was directly involved in encouraging the city to switch to the corrosive Flint River water that led to lead poisoning and other toxins in Flint’s water supply. Leaked emails reveal that Dennis Muchmore warned Snyder in September that the crisis could become a dangerous “political football.” Muchmore, who was Snyder’s chief of staff at the time, encouraged blaming city officials for the crisis.

http://www.mintpressnews.com/nestle-guzz...ms/213360/

See also:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-mo...32150.html

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27-05-2016, 03:44 PM
RE: Snyder administration botches criminal investigations in Flint
Like I said - people should be facing prison time for this.

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