So "Jesus wept "
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15-10-2013, 03:33 PM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
Jeebus tried to start a war in Jerusalem and paid the price.

He knew the risks and his gamble didn't pay off. He must've been pissed off that his mates abandoned him.

He would've been shitting his pants when he got arrested.

He never wanted to die, and couldn't have cared less about people's sins.

He never forgave anybody for anything; he was too busy dying.
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15-10-2013, 03:46 PM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(15-10-2013 03:02 PM)kim Wrote:  
(15-10-2013 02:28 PM)grizzlysnake Wrote:  I can understand the appeal but its dishonest to take it any other way except as allegory and metaphor.

People "take" a story whatever way they are given it.

For some reason, children are taught that Sisyphus, condemned for eternity to roll a bolder up a hill, is myth or that Santa or St Nick was a real guy who remains celebrated in traditional myth by a show of generosity. However, children are not pressed to consider these stories anything but fiction.

The stories of people in other books - Qur'an, Bible stories, etc.,. - these stories are often considered to be either real or divinely inspired as real interpretations of real people and events. For some reason, children are pressed to consider these stories not only truthful but part of historical fact.

I think it's very important to understand the ideas and critical thinking stories like these impart. However I think it is of the utmost importance to stress beyond doubt especially to children, these are mythical stories and purely fictitious.
Well of course, its meaning has been corrupted. You'd also be surprised how often some children know what is fiction and non-fiction. At my library we have this summer reading program they spin a wheel and I ask them a question according to where it lands. Now this child read a book of jewish tales and I asked is this book fiction or non-fiction? She said fiction, I asked why she said because they were made up stories. You wouldn't believe the smile on my face thenBig Grin but was ultimately ruined when the mother told her it was non-fiction. Wasn't my place to argue but I had some hope she would learn the truth. Yes, parents are being irresponsible when they distort and not allow their children to figure things out themselves. Should always ask, why they think its true or not.

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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16-10-2013, 12:04 AM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(15-10-2013 03:33 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Jeebus tried to start a war in Jerusalem and paid the price.

He knew the risks and his gamble didn't pay off. He must've been pissed off that his mates abandoned him.

He would've been shitting his pants when he got arrested.

He never wanted to die, and couldn't have cared less about people's sins.

He never forgave anybody for anything; he was too busy dying.

Is it bad that this is very funny to .Laugh out load

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16-10-2013, 12:21 AM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(15-10-2013 01:10 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(15-10-2013 05:10 AM)BizzysaidAss Wrote:  And Hebrews prove he was not crucified

What do you mean by this? Is this the book where it says he was hanged instead of crucified, or something?


(15-10-2013 07:24 AM)BizzysaidAss Wrote:  Awe If Jesus was a real guy way back then and this was true then its really sad poor guy .

Meh. If he were a real person, he deliberately rocked the boat of a powerful theocratic group that was known for executing people. It was sort of an occupational hazard.
1) I found the verse i posted on this website it says that Hebrews 5:7-8 proves it.
http://www.answering-christianity.com/hebrews5_7.htm
2) Good point.

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16-10-2013, 06:14 AM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(16-10-2013 12:21 AM)BizzysaidAss Wrote:  1) I found the verse i posted on this website it says that Hebrews 5:7-8 proves it.
http://www.answering-christianity.com/hebrews5_7.htm

That doesn't really prove it. Any Christian who wants to take a (semi) literal approach to the Bible will say the "He heard his cries and will save him" part to mean that he won't let him languish in hell, or something.

Also, given how full of contradictions the Bible is, trying to use one verse to prove another is problematic. I'd say a better approach is: "there's no evidence it's anything other than a book of Hebrew mythology, so for the time being, I don't see any reason to assume Jesus existed, let alone was crucified."
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16-10-2013, 06:43 AM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(16-10-2013 06:14 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(16-10-2013 12:21 AM)BizzysaidAss Wrote:  1) I found the verse i posted on this website it says that Hebrews 5:7-8 proves it.
http://www.answering-christianity.com/hebrews5_7.htm

That doesn't really prove it. Any Christian who wants to take a (semi) literal approach to the Bible will say the "He heard his cries and will save him" part to mean that he won't let him languish in hell, or something.

Also, given how full of contradictions the Bible is, trying to use one verse to prove another is problematic. I'd say a better approach is: "there's no evidence it's anything other than a book of Hebrew mythology, so for the time being, I don't see any reason to assume Jesus existed, let alone was crucified."

I will keep that in mind Smile Thanks .I really wish i was as bright as you like everyone on here seems well educated.
That's cool that Hebrew has myth i hate to sound like a dummy but when i think of myth i thing of Greeks .

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16-10-2013, 07:08 AM
RE: So "Jesus wept "
(15-10-2013 08:47 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Matthew 26:39
Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will."

Luke 22:42
"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."

Mark 14:36
"Abba, Father," he said, "everything is possible for you. Take this cup from me. Yet not what I will, but what you will."

Pretty clear.
Jebus did not "will" to die. His "will" was NOT to die.
His will, and the will of the Father are not the same. He submitted, (yet according to trinitarian doctrine, they should be identical.)
He (is made to look) he felt he was entirely constrained by external circumstances,

I guess we can say he didn't have "Free Will" to decide for himself...


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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