So your god is real, now what?
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15-02-2012, 02:41 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
(15-02-2012 02:34 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  
(15-02-2012 02:29 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  I don't know His reasoning, mind, or will.

Ok, so it's the case that you don't understand the logic but you trust that there is a reason for God's actions.

I think I'm beginning to understand.

And from some of your other posts I take it that you don't believe in free will, in that you think every thought, desire, action of every single person is pre-decided by God, we don't actually have control of our actions, it's just an illusion?

Am I right?

Yes.

Also, the faith part is faith that an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent God is in control of me. This is liberating in the fact that I believe a perfect and infinite God has designed my life in all its aspects.

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15-02-2012, 02:48 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
(15-02-2012 02:41 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Yes.

Also, the faith part is faith that an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent God is in control of me. This is liberating in the fact that I believe a perfect and infinite God has designed my life in all its aspects.

Do you not think that that can be a rather dangerous belief, not for you but for a less intelligent and more criminally inclined person? If they held that belief they may think it gives them the freedom to do whatever they please (as in theft, rape, murder etc.) and it isn't there fault, it's God's plan.

Also, don't you think it's a little unfair for God to decide every aspect of my life, give me no control over any of my actions, and then punish me for them?

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15-02-2012, 04:09 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
We need a different Christian or other religion to chime in. KC's theology is simple and well-understood here, so no new information seems to be forthcoming.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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15-02-2012, 09:52 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
(15-02-2012 02:41 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  This is liberating in the fact that I believe a perfect and infinite God has designed my life in all its aspects.

I will not be kind here.
The liberation you feel is the advocating of responsibility and thinking for yourself.
It is not freedom, but lack of freedom you are compelled to.
In this lack of freedom you have comfort.
You are afraid of freedom so you chose slavery to an imaginary master.
Your epiphany was the mind overloaded by a sense of anxiety of freedom and once you realized that you could shed this responsibility you did.
The true value you represent is as a beacon of warning for others.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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16-02-2012, 02:41 AM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
God made man so he could save him?
So he is pretty much the same as a fireman who starts firers?

With no free will is god just having a long Sims game?

If there is no free will, then god is punishing us for things he has made us do.
Would that mean that to be free and happy in the eyes of god it would be to reject his control and seize free will for yourself?
Is that our heaven, to break free of the yoke that may lead you to the hell of continuing servitude to an ungrateful puppet master?

It’s a little dammed if you do, dammed if you don’t isn’t it?
God made us to do wrong so he could punish us and/or save us depending on some whim, and just to make it less interesting god knows what we’re going to do long before we do it.
But to take the wild card out of it, not only does god already know what you’re going to do, it’s him setting it all up and making you do it.
And then getting all hot and bothered over it…

LOL… Imagine if it was real!

A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything. Friedrich Nietzsche
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18-02-2012, 05:18 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
(16-02-2012 02:41 AM)Karl Wrote:  God made man so he could save him?
So he is pretty much the same as a fireman who starts firers?

Great quote...
If you don't mind I will borrow this from you for future arguments off this forum.
Thanks in advance.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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18-02-2012, 10:37 PM
RE: So your god is real, now what?
(15-02-2012 09:52 PM)Thomas Wrote:  The liberation you feel is the advocating of responsibility and thinking for yourself.

I think you must mean 'abdication of responsibility'.

Otherwise, well said.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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