Sodomy - why is it wrong?
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02-12-2013, 11:57 PM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:35 PM)nach_in Wrote:  
(02-12-2013 11:34 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I think it's fun myself...but I'm a heathen.

Shocking

What?


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02-12-2013, 11:58 PM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:48 PM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Because the Celts were an entirely different culture... from what is now Great Britain and Ireland.

That is besides the point. You and your friend are engaged in a mutual masturbation session that the Jewish prohibition on homosexuality is about "control" and you are alleging that all undemocratic war-oriented regimes were the same. That is plainly bullshit. Both the Celts and the Spartans were undemocratic and war-oriented and they did not prohibit homosexuality.
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03-12-2013, 12:04 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:57 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(02-12-2013 11:35 PM)nach_in Wrote:  Shocking

What?

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03-12-2013, 12:08 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:42 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(02-12-2013 11:32 PM)nach_in Wrote:  I know that we like to use them as an example of how advanced they were in comparison to us, but they weren't that free and inclusive as we may think at first glance

Which contradicts your contention that the prohibition on homosexuality is about "control". There are many ancient societies--besides Sparta--that weren't free by the standards of the West today and they did not prohibit homosexuality. The idea that morality is that activity which is concerned with appeasing an angry deity entered into Western thought via Judaism. You can read Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics to get an idea of how the Ancient Greeks viewed morality prior to Jewish contamination.

You are inventing fairy-tales that erase the damage Jews have done to Western thought.

First of all, I clarified that I think homosexuality is one of a varied set of ways of control. Not every society use every way.

I didn't talked about the jews and I don't give a fuck about your, apparently, very anti-semitic remarks.

I'm just saying that the control of human needs and desires is a usual way in every society to establish and maintain control of the people. In every power relationship you'll find some sort of prohibition of some basic need, whereas is food, sex or clothing is irrelevant and if it is embedded in a mythological narrative is also irrelevant to my point.

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03-12-2013, 12:08 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:57 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(02-12-2013 11:35 PM)nach_in Wrote:  Shocking

What?

nothing, just joking Thumbsup

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03-12-2013, 12:09 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(02-12-2013 11:58 PM)Chippy Wrote:  
(02-12-2013 11:48 PM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Because the Celts were an entirely different culture... from what is now Great Britain and Ireland.

That is besides the point. You and your friend are engaged in a mutual masturbation session that the Jewish prohibition on homosexuality is about "control" and you are alleging that all undemocratic war-oriented regimes were the same. That is plainly bullshit. Both the Celts and the Spartans were undemocratic and war-oriented and they did not prohibit homosexuality.

I never said anything of the sort...

I'm saying that two cultures from the same region, from the same time, with similarly totalitarian regimes, likely had similar systems.

The Hittite rulers controlled every aspect of their citizen's lives, from the Old Testament it seems apparent that the rulers of the Israelites exercised a similar level of control...

Its simply an observation... Not saying every totalitarian regime was/is the same, just saying these two appear to be very similar. And perhaps from the Hittites we can see just what a brutal regime the Israelites lived under.

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03-12-2013, 12:37 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(03-12-2013 12:08 AM)nach_in Wrote:  First of all, I clarified that I think homosexuality is one of a varied set of ways of control. Not every society use every way.

Everyone does it except those that don't.

Quote:I didn't talked about the jews and I don't give a fuck about your, apparently, very anti-semitic remarks.

Idiot. Prior to the influence of Judaism on Europe via Christianity, homosexuality was not deemed to warrant the death penalty. That is the central point here. Your bullshit theorising about "power relationship[s]" doesn't change that.

Quote:I'm just saying that the control of human needs and desires is a usual way in every society to establish and maintain control of the people.

Bullshit. Not every (your word) society is/was like North Korea.

Quote: In every power relationship you'll find some sort of prohibition of some basic need, whereas is food, sex or clothing is irrelevant a...

Bullshit. What "basic need" is prohibited in Australia or New Zealand?
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03-12-2013, 12:52 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(03-12-2013 12:09 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Its simply an observation... Not saying every totalitarian regime was/is the same, just saying these two appear to be very similar. And perhaps from the Hittites we can see just what a brutal regime the Israelites lived under.

It's a flawed generalisation that fails to account for the introduction of an essentially alien idea into Western thought.

Also, history genius, the Hittites did not prohibit homosexual relations unless they were incestuous.[1][2] So your idea is of no merit whatsoever.
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03-12-2013, 01:08 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(03-12-2013 12:52 AM)Chippy Wrote:  
(03-12-2013 12:09 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Its simply an observation... Not saying every totalitarian regime was/is the same, just saying these two appear to be very similar. And perhaps from the Hittites we can see just what a brutal regime the Israelites lived under.

It's a flawed generalisation that fails to account for the introduction of an essentially alien idea into Western thought.

Also, history genius, the Hittites did not prohibit homosexual relations unless they were incestuous.[1][2] So your idea is of no merit whatsoever.

Look through my posts... Where the fuck did I say anything about homosexuality?

I was talking about the strictly controlled lives people lived, whether the Hittites allowed homosexuality while the Israelites banned it is totally inconsequential to me...

The Hittite society lived by rules... every aspect was controlled, and from what I've read of the Old Testament, the Israelites had a similarly intrusive and brutal regime, perhaps more so.

I wasn't talking about laws against homosexuality, or other minor details... Just the observation that both regimes were excessively controlling and strict. And that from what is known about the Hittite world, we might get an insight into the lives of the Israelites as well.

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03-12-2013, 01:20 AM
RE: Sodomy - why is it wrong?
(03-12-2013 01:08 AM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  Look through my posts... Where the fuck did I say anything about homosexuality?

You wrote:

The Israelites and Hittites were from the same region and therefore probably had cultural similarities.[1]

The implication being that the Hittites too prohibited homosexuality.

Quote:I was talking about the strictly controlled lives people lived, whether the Hittites allowed homosexuality while the Israelites banned it is totally inconsequential to me...

Yeah because you were just stickin' it to da man and stuff and I interrupted your mutual masturbation section with historical facts.

Quote:The Hittite society lived by rules... every aspect was controlled,

And yet homosexuality was not prohibited. So your thesis finds no support, not even from the Israelites' neighbours. You are entirely unable to account for the prohibition of homosexuality in terms of "control" and "totalitarianism" yet you refuse to abandon that baseless idea. You are education-resistant.
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