Some Questions for the Theists
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13-08-2015, 11:25 AM
Some Questions for the Theists
Do you believe that god has given everyone free will to choose whether to serve him or not? If so, what happens to aborted babies spiritually speaking? Do they automatically go to heaven? If so, what happened to their free will? Are they forced to serve god forever and ever?

(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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13-08-2015, 12:26 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
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(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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13-08-2015, 01:24 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  Do you believe that god has given everyone free will to choose whether to serve him or not? If so, what happens to aborted babies spiritually speaking? Do they automatically go to heaven? If so, what happened to their free will? Are they forced to serve god forever and ever?

No. I don't believe in free will.

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13-08-2015, 01:30 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 01:24 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  Do you believe that god has given everyone free will to choose whether to serve him or not? If so, what happens to aborted babies spiritually speaking? Do they automatically go to heaven? If so, what happened to their free will? Are they forced to serve god forever and ever?

No. I don't believe in free will.

Calvanist?

(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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13-08-2015, 01:31 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 01:30 PM)Octapulse Wrote:  
(13-08-2015 01:24 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  No. I don't believe in free will.

Calvanist?

Highly.

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13-08-2015, 01:34 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
Aborted fetuses and embryos... since life "begins" at conception. Yes, I can just see it, when my wife and I went through IVF a soul immediately entered that egg cell when my sperm was injected into the egg... Can you freeze souls? Just asking since the embryos that weren't used were frozen.
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13-08-2015, 01:41 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  Do you believe that god has given everyone free will to choose whether to serve him or not?
No. I believe that God gave to all His children moral agency to choose between good and evil. So, God gave to all moral agency to choose whether to serve Him or not.
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  If so, what happens to aborted babies spiritually speaking? Do they automatically go to heaven? If so, what happened to their free will? Are they forced to serve god forever and ever?
Nobody knows. God didn't reveal this.

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13-08-2015, 01:57 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 01:34 PM)Iñigo Wrote:  Aborted fetuses and embryos... since life "begins" at conception. Yes, I can just see it, when my wife and I went through IVF a soul immediately entered that egg cell when my sperm was injected into the egg... Can you freeze souls? Just asking since the embryos that weren't used were frozen.

I am not stating that this is my belief, I do not believe we have a soul at all. I am just basing my questioning on assertions that I have heard from many a xian who tend to believe all aborted fetuses go to heaven

(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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13-08-2015, 02:05 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 01:41 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  Do you believe that god has given everyone free will to choose whether to serve him or not?
No. I believe that God gave to all His children moral agency to choose between good and evil. So, God gave to all moral agency to choose whether to serve Him or not.
(13-08-2015 11:25 AM)Octapulse Wrote:  If so, what happens to aborted babies spiritually speaking? Do they automatically go to heaven? If so, what happened to their free will? Are they forced to serve god forever and ever?
Nobody knows. God didn't reveal this.

Even if this has not been "revealed" we can still follow a line of reasoning. If we as humans are granted "free will", namely that we have a choice in our allegiance outside the confines of predestination, if aborted babies go to heaven, then their free will has been usurped. If they go to hell, their free will also has been usurped. It creates a paradox. Now ultimately if we do not have free will, then it is astronomically irrational that a god of love would doom all of mankind with a sinful nature for which Adam & Eve had no choice over the action that lead to the fall. Furthermore, why would a god of love place such a fucking thing in the middle of the garden of Eden in the first place? I don't know if you are a parent or not, but it is rather akin to a parent taking a cache of arsenic and placing it in the middle of the living room where little toddler Suzie is playing with her dolls and telling her not to get into the arsenic. Oh yeah, let's make the arsenic look like a baby bottle. That makes perfect sense. FFS!

(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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13-08-2015, 02:52 PM
RE: Some Questions for the Theists
(13-08-2015 02:05 PM)Octapulse Wrote:  Even if this has not been "revealed" we can still follow a line of reasoning. If we as humans are granted "free will", namely that we have a choice in our allegiance outside the confines of predestination, if aborted babies go to heaven, then their free will has been usurped. If they go to hell, their free will also has been usurped.
"Moral agency" not "free will"
If they go to hell then you are right.
If they go to heaven then moral agency was not usurped. Because every spirit before he or she enters physical body makes a choice:" I want to come back to heaven to my Father after mortal life". So, if he or she didn't have a chance to live life they already made a choice to be back with Father.
(13-08-2015 02:05 PM)Octapulse Wrote:  It creates a paradox. Now ultimately if we do not have free will, then it is astronomically irrational that a god of love would doom all of mankind with a sinful nature for which Adam & Eve had no choice over the action that lead to the fall. Furthermore, why would a god of love place such a fucking thing in the middle of the garden of Eden in the first place? I don't know if you are a parent or not, but it is rather akin to a parent taking a cache of arsenic and placing it in the middle of the living room where little toddler Suzie is playing with her dolls and telling her not to get into the arsenic. Oh yeah, let's make the arsenic look like a baby bottle. That makes perfect sense. FFS!
You are like all those many, many Christians do not understand what really happened in the Garden of Eden(Fall of Adam and Eve story) and what really happened in the garden of Gethsemane(Atonement story)
Forbidden fruit was not bad/not poison. This fruit made Adam and Eve like Gods who know good and evil.
God gave them a choice:
stay the way you are(not like Gods) in this Garden(GOOD choice)
or
change, so, you can learn MORE things(good and evil). By learning them you progress, you becoming like one of Us. (A BETTER choice).
Analogy:
do not go outside of the house so you will be safe all the time,
but if you go you will not be safe all the time, but you will learn many things - good and bad. Your life will have many great experiences but also many hard experiences.
staying at safe home forever is good choice
but to leave home and learn many things and have more experiences is better choice.
Adam and Eve were not toddlers. They already had hair you know were. They could handle to be outside the comfy house.

Partaking of fruit of knowledge of good and evil was NOT a choice between
good and evil
but between
good and better

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