Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
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24-06-2017, 04:10 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(23-05-2017 08:31 PM)JesseB Wrote:  Jews never came from Egypt.

Don't be so sure. There's plenty of archaeological evidence showing that at least some of the tribes of Israel were in Egypt.

I have my own original theory about the Exodus. The short version of my theory is:

1] Israelites originated in Akkad but settled in Canaan.

2] Patriarch (Jacob) and clan leaders traveled to Egypt during famine.

3] Upon death of Jacob, those clan leaders who were denied an inheritance (Reuben, Simeon and Levi, and Benjamin) remained in Egypt, while the other clan leaders returned to Canaan

4] The clans in Egypt traded with the clans in Canaan for a time, but war and conflict, and the cost of escorting caravans resulted in a halt in trade between the two groups.

5] The two groups grew apart culturally due to the separation

6] The 4 clans in Egypt eventually left and returned to Canaan.

7] The Exodus Trilogy (Exodus, Leviticus and Numbers) is a cleverly designed National Unity Document intended to hide or downplay the fact that the tribes/clans had been separated; or to deceitfully show that the clans were always together.

Archaeologically, we see evidence that there was an expansion of settlements were Reuben's tribe was located, plus an expansion of settlements south of Jerusalem where the tribe of Simeon was located. An expansion in Jerusalem where the tribe of Benjamin was incorporated with the tribe of Judah and the Levites were dispersed among all the tribal areas. The expansions all took place during the same time period.

(23-05-2017 08:31 PM)JesseB Wrote:  Jews are quite literally Canaanites, they CAME from Canaan originally.

Originally they came from Akkad.

(23-05-2017 09:18 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  There was no Exodus. Egypt controlled the entire Near East / Levant. Leaving Egypt for another area still controlled by Egypt makes no sense.
They made it up.

Or they exaggerated a great deal.

I seriously doubt Egypt "controlled" the entire Near East/Levant, rather Egypt exercised suzerainty over the region, demanding tribute for the various kingdoms and tribes.

The enemy numbered six hundred - including women and children - and we abolished them utterly, leaving not even a baby alive to cry for its dead mother. This is incomparably the greatest victory that was ever achieved by the Christian soldiers of the United States. -- Mark Twain
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24-06-2017, 04:12 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(23-06-2017 06:04 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  The bible isn't 50000 years old. As we know it today is what, not even a thousand? Sure somebody can correct me on the specifics.

Some parts such as the first 36 chapters of Genesis were written 4,000 to 2,000 BCE. However, the Old Testament as everyone knows and loves was mostly written between 700 and 500 BCE.

The enemy numbered six hundred - including women and children - and we abolished them utterly, leaving not even a baby alive to cry for its dead mother. This is incomparably the greatest victory that was ever achieved by the Christian soldiers of the United States. -- Mark Twain
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24-06-2017, 04:13 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(23-06-2017 07:16 PM)Chas Wrote:  The natural order of things is that homosexual behaviors are common in many species, including humans.

Your ignorance is appalling. Drinking Beverage

Some mammals eat their young. Should Humans do the same?

The enemy numbered six hundred - including women and children - and we abolished them utterly, leaving not even a baby alive to cry for its dead mother. This is incomparably the greatest victory that was ever achieved by the Christian soldiers of the United States. -- Mark Twain
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24-06-2017, 04:29 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  Jesus could not possibly have been the Messiah

There was no need for a Messiah or for Jesus to die.

Leviticus 16:29 “This is to be a perpetual statute for you. In the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you must humble yourselves and do no work of any kind, both the native citizen and the foreigner who resides in your midst, 16:30 for on this day atonement is to be made for you to cleanse you from all your sins; you must be clean before the Lord.

See? Everyone was cleansed of their sins.

(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  Jesus could not possibly have been the Son of God

Sure he could. However, Jesus would not have been the only son, as the texts show Yahweh had several sons.

Also, the blood-line of Jesus is barred from entering Heaven.

Nehemiah 13:1 On that day the book of Moses was read aloud in the hearing of the people. They found written in it that no Ammonite or Moabite may ever enter the assembly of God.

Ruth 4:13 So Boaz married Ruth and had sexual relations with her. The Lord enabled her to conceive and she gave birth to a son. 4:17 The neighbor women named him, saying, “A son has been born to Naomi.” They named him Obed. Now he became the father of Jesse – David’s father!


Since Jesus is descended of David, how could Jesus possibly be in the "assembly of God."

(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  The stories of the Creation, the Garden of Eden, and the Flood are all fairy tales.

Even fairy tales have a kernel of truth. There is mounting evidence of tsunamis sweeping through Pacific and Indian Oceans 12,000 years ago, possibly due to a fragmented asteroid or comet striking Earth and destroying the West Antarctic Ice Sheet.


(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  The story of the conquest of Jericho is pure propaganda

The bible claims the Israelites destroyed 16 cities. Only 10 of the 16 have been located and identified.

Of those 10 cities that were located and identified, only 3 of the 10 showed any signs of destruction, but the evidence of destruction also shows that the Israelites did not do it.

For one of those cities, and I'm sorry I don't remember specifically which one (it is either Beth-el, Hazor or Lachish) the evidence circumstantially weighs in favor of the Israelites.

Of the remaining 7 cities, none of them were destroyed, and three of them were not even inhabited (Ai, Gibeon and most embarrassingly Jericho). The sad thing it doesn't matter whether you accept the early date or the late date for the Exodus, those cities were simply not inhabited during that time period.

The enemy numbered six hundred - including women and children - and we abolished them utterly, leaving not even a baby alive to cry for its dead mother. This is incomparably the greatest victory that was ever achieved by the Christian soldiers of the United States. -- Mark Twain
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24-06-2017, 04:44 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 04:13 PM)Mircea Wrote:  Some mammals eat their young. Should Humans do the same?

No one is talking about should. If it exists it's natural.

Chas' point still stands.

Your bigotry is duly noted though Drinking Beverage

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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24-06-2017, 04:57 PM (This post was last modified: 24-06-2017 05:06 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 04:10 PM)Mircea Wrote:  Don't be so sure. There's plenty of archaeological evidence showing that at least some of the tribes of Israel were in Egypt.

Oh really. Care to share that.
We know Egypt controlled the entire Near East. We know when Semitic tribes were (already settled) in Canaan. The Exodus is debunked.

Quote:I have my own original theory about the Exodus. The short version of my theory is:
1] Israelites originated in Akkad but settled in Canaan.

Lovely. Got any evidence for that ?

Quote:2] Patriarch (Jacob) and clan leaders traveled to Egypt during famine.

Jacob was a myth. There is no evidence for that or for him.

Quote:3] Upon death of Jacob, those clan leaders who were denied an inheritance (Reuben, Simeon and Levi, and Benjamin) remained in Egypt, while the other clan leaders returned to Canaan

Nice story. Needs some vampires and dragons.

Quote:4] The clans in Egypt traded with the clans in Canaan for a time, but war and conflict, and the cost of escorting caravans resulted in a halt in trade between the two groups.

Never happened. We know the trade routes, and direction and places of trade.

Quote:7] The Exodus Trilogy (Exodus, Leviticus and Numbers) is a cleverly designed National Unity Document intended to hide or downplay the fact that the tribes/clans had been separated; or to deceitfully show that the clans were always together.

It's designed", but there is no evidence for that "separation".

Quote:Archaeologically, we see evidence that there was an expansion of settlements were Reuben's tribe was located, plus an expansion of settlements south of Jerusalem where the tribe of Simeon was located. An expansion in Jerusalem where the tribe of Benjamin was incorporated with the tribe of Judah and the Levites were dispersed among all the tribal areas. The expansions all took place during the same time period.

Evidence required.

Quote:Originally they came from Akkad.

Evidence required.

Quote:Or they exaggerated a great deal.

No. There are good reasons for what they wrote, the way they did. It's not 'exaggeration". It's all made up.

Quote:I seriously doubt Egypt "controlled" the entire Near East/Levant, rather Egypt exercised suzerainty over the region, demanding tribute for the various kingdoms and tribes.

Because you know no history.

Quote:Some parts such as the first 36 chapters of Genesis were written 4,000 to 2,000 BCE. However, the Old Testament as everyone knows and loves was mostly written between 700 and 500 BCE.

Nope. Totally false. You have no evidence for that. 4000 BCE there was not even a Tribal Confederation in place yet. (We know when and why that happened). Your history is nothing but crap. The Bible was not "written". Traditions from the two kingdoms were "assembled in Babylon. Genesis 1-36 could not have been "written" when you say for many reasons.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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24-06-2017, 05:04 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 04:29 PM)Mircea Wrote:  Leviticus 16:29 “This is to be a perpetual statute for you. In the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you must humble yourselves and do no work of any kind, both the native citizen and the foreigner who resides in your midst, 16:30 for on this day atonement is to be made for you to cleanse you from all your sins; you must be clean before the Lord.

See? Everyone was cleansed of their sins.

No. The Jews believed in ANIMAL and other types, NOT human sacrifice, AND the role of a messiah was not to die for anything.

Quote:Also, the blood-line of Jesus is barred from entering Heaven.

Jews didn't "go to heaven" when they died. They went to Sheol, which is not where the divine beings lived.

Quote:Even fairy tales have a kernel of truth. There is mounting evidence of tsunamis sweeping through Pacific and Indian Oceans 12,000 years ago, possibly due to a fragmented asteroid or comet striking Earth and destroying the West Antarctic Ice Sheet.

Great. Provide this "mounting evidence" and then show us that cultural systems were in place which could "record" that event.

Too bad. Israeli archaeologists, (who would have the most vested interest to find this nonsense to be true) don't buy this bullshit.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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24-06-2017, 05:29 PM (This post was last modified: 24-06-2017 10:14 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 04:13 PM)Mircea Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 07:16 PM)Chas Wrote:  The natural order of things is that homosexual behaviors are common in many species, including humans.

Your ignorance is appalling. Drinking Beverage

Some mammals eat their young. Should Humans do the same?

The analogy is false. EVERY specie on this planet has a sub-set of it's population with same-sex behaviors. Equating the complex process that produces these orientations, which is NOT in any way under personal control to eating one's young is ignorant and bigoted.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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24-06-2017, 09:27 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
(24-06-2017 04:29 PM)Mircea Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  Jesus could not possibly have been the Messiah

There was no need for a Messiah or for Jesus to die.

Leviticus 16:29 “This is to be a perpetual statute for you. In the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you must humble yourselves and do no work of any kind, both the native citizen and the foreigner who resides in your midst, 16:30 for on this day atonement is to be made for you to cleanse you from all your sins; you must be clean before the Lord.

See? Everyone was cleansed of their sins.

OK, I'm not disputing that. My argument as to why Jesus could not possibly have been the savior whose coming was predicted by the Old Testament authors is that they simply didn't believe anything Jesus taught. They didn't believe in the resurrection of the dead. They didn't believe in the Last Judgment. They didn't believe in Jesus's teachings about the forgiveness of sins. They didn't believe in his morality. And they were looking for someone who would preserve Jewish religious observances.

(24-06-2017 04:29 PM)Mircea Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  Jesus could not possibly have been the Son of God
Sure he could. However, Jesus would not have been the only son, as the texts show Yahweh had several sons.
Then let me restate it. Jesus could not have been divine-- because his most important prophecy, as recorded in Mark 13 and elsewhere, turned out to be false.

(24-06-2017 04:29 PM)Mircea Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  The stories of the Creation, the Garden of Eden, and the Flood are all fairy tales.

Even fairy tales have a kernel of truth. There is mounting evidence of tsunamis sweeping through Pacific and Indian Oceans 12,000 years ago, possibly due to a fragmented asteroid or comet striking Earth and destroying the West Antarctic Ice Sheet.
Well, I won't dispute that it is possible for fairy tales to have some kernel of truth. But the creation story is wrong on every count. It's wrong as to the time of the creation, the duration of creation, the sequence of creation-- it's even wrong about what was created. That's about as wrong as it could possibly be.

(24-06-2017 04:29 PM)Mircea Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 11:21 AM)thereverent1 Wrote:  The story of the conquest of Jericho is pure propaganda
The bible claims the Israelites destroyed 16 cities. Only 10 of the 16 have been located and identified.

That's not the full story. Chapter 12 of the book of Joshua lists 31 kings who were subjugated by the Israelites in their conquest of the promised land. All of those kings were killed, and all of the towns and cities over which they ruled were destroyed and were burned to the ground. Chapter 23 states specifically that God helped the Israelites at every step. That's the part that is propaganda. Jericho is especially interesting. The prostitute Rahab housed the 2 Israeli spies who went to Jericho to scope it out and gather intel. How did the 2 spies escape from a city that was on the lookout for any Israelis? The Bible tells us that Rahab's house was actually part of the wall of Jericho. So she just let a rope down from her window and the spies climbed down and made their getaway.
So how did the walls of Jericho really fall down? The Bible says that they fell down at the moment that the Israeli army shouted, presumably because of the direct intervention of God. But a much more likely explanation is that the 2 spies just called up to Rahab's window and she threw down a rope for them to climb up, no doubt in the company of an elite strike force. It's the specific intervention of God that is propaganda, regardless of whether or not the Israelites actually conquered the city.
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24-06-2017, 09:58 PM
RE: Sorry for the last post wrong word but to ask is God actually a bad guy.
If we ignore for a second that there is no good reason to think any god exists, then yes, the god of the Bible is the bad guy of every 80's action movie.

Except for Hans Gruber, he's too cool for that. Plus, he's already the Metatron.

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