Spin-off of Why I believe
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12-04-2017, 06:19 PM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(12-04-2017 05:33 PM)adey67 Wrote:  I kinda feel sorry for them, theists weapons are so limited and primitive its never really a fair fight like spears v machine guns

What makes it all the worse is that they come armed with spears while believing they hold tactical nukes.

"If my God exists, then the laws in the Bible should apply to everyone. I am certain my God exists, so ..." -- words of a theocratic fascist justifying theocratic fascism.
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12-04-2017, 08:48 PM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(12-04-2017 09:45 AM)whateverist Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 08:13 AM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  Perhaps you should reread my statement "an atheist is exercising a belief that deities do not exist and having a disregard to any religious teachings". There is no claim here that atheism is a religion but rather in fact dismisses all religious because their is no deities and dismisses any and all religious teachings. By thinking through what I stated how do conclude I presented atheism as a religion?

Read again on the subject of truth. I presented that three opposing worldviews each believe they are right in their "own" eyes and in reality this three worldviews do claim that each is right in their own eyes. This is only possible if one accepted that truth is relative. Logically if one applies the law of non contradiction two or more opposing views cannot both be true at the same time so all three could be false but only one can be true "absolutely". Reread my statement and you will see that I did not claim that one of the three was absolutely true. I did point out the difference between the relative true claim being contradictory as opposed to absolute true where only one of the three could be absolutely true. Again I never stated that above that I believe one of the three "is" absolutely true.

The point here being made is this; if I believe that Christianity is absolutely true and you believe atheism is absolutely true then we can both be wrong but only one of us can be right. Can either side provide definitive proof that God does or does not exist. No. So again both can be wrong and only one right yet there is no definitive proof. Thing is if one is true one should choose wisely. This is the dilemma that brought in play Pascal's wager

Is it ever right to kill someone because of what they believe?
If one follows the premise "It all depends on what they believe" to it final conclusion then you open the door to justifiable genocide depending on who gets to do the deciding.

Is it right to kill a baby because if god tells you to? I may not answer this to your satisfaction but I won't dodge it either. The Bible presents many difficult things for us as humans to understand and justify in our minds. Also it is natural to filter these things through view we hold to be true. If our view is that God is holy good and just and all knowing then is it possible for me to say it's right or wrong. Is God a murderer for killing the Egyptian babies? Have you ever considered that from the position of the Israelites? Do you consider slavery wrong? Do you consider evil torturous slavery even more wrong? Suppose your were that Israelite father slave and Pharoah killed "your" son because he feared your growing numbers. Was that ever right. Is God then a murderer because He killed the Egyptian babies to free you from further slavery and evil? Was the United States murderers for killing the Japanese babies with those two bombs? If one fairly studies the Bible in context one will find that God's judgement is always based on evil?

Are you going to dodge this question; Is it right to kill a baby in the womb just because one wants to?


Is abortion your escape strategy? Floundering in supporting claims that :hobo:religious belief has some positive effect in the world are you now retreating to what you take to be higher moral ground? Good luck.

Escape? Naw but maybe a temporary ceasefire is in order the wolf pack has about run this poor old dog in the ground. Hobo Nothing like a good nights rest. Good night all
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13-04-2017, 01:04 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(12-04-2017 06:19 PM)Shirina Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 05:33 PM)adey67 Wrote:  I kinda feel sorry for them, theists weapons are so limited and primitive its never really a fair fight like spears v machine guns

What makes it all the worse is that they come armed with spears while believing they hold tactical nukes.

I always wonder what happens to the ones who get spanked and run away... whether they a. then go to church and drink the wine and chew the wafer and think "Yeesh, everything I was ever told about evil atheists is TRUE", or b. they go back home and think "Fuck, I couldn't answer those questions. I wonder if what I believe is really true." My money is on a.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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13-04-2017, 01:47 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(13-04-2017 01:04 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 06:19 PM)Shirina Wrote:  What makes it all the worse is that they come armed with spears while believing they hold tactical nukes.

I always wonder what happens to the ones who get spanked and run away... whether they a. then go to church and drink the wine and chew the wafer and think "Yeesh, everything I was ever told about evil atheists is TRUE", or b. they go back home and think "Fuck, I couldn't answer those questions. I wonder if what I believe is really true." My money is on a.

I'll put fifty quid on a.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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13-04-2017, 04:15 AM (This post was last modified: 13-04-2017 04:19 AM by SYZ.)
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(11-04-2017 06:48 PM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  ... Perhaps it would be better to ask why is the object of one person's faith right and the object of another person's wrong? I would then say neither is wrong to them. They are simply exercising their held belief in Islam and its teachings just as an atheist is exercising a belief that deities do not exist and having a disregard to any religious teachings and Christians are exercising their belief in Christianity. Each of the three beliefs believe they are right and in a relative world each can be seen as to be right in their own eyes...

This three-way comparison is nonsense. Atheists have no "beliefs" and they promote no "beliefs". Christians and Muslims do—supported by some invisible, unevidenced supernatural entity of all things LOL.

And the fact that you support the beliefs and rights of Muslims, and their associated Sharia laws is, to say the least, offensive to me as an atheist.

EDIT: Deleted my non-stamp collector analogy... somebody else posted it earlier. Sadcryface

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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13-04-2017, 06:55 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(12-04-2017 12:25 PM)Naielis Wrote:  
(10-04-2017 07:48 PM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  This thread is started per the request of SeaJay and others and as yet there were several posts presented there which time did not allow a response, please copy and paste any post from there that anyone would wish to continue. I will respond to those as time permits. I acknowledge the suggestions posted toward the end of the original post and thank everyone for their patience with the newbie

PS: Paleophyte,, chocolate is always a favorite in its many forms but when it comes to milkshakes a butterscotch malt tops the list, briefs here over boxers and 39 light years from here makes my head hurt to comprehend such a distance. Our universe is grand indeed isn't it

Do you have a thread where you explain your reasons for being a theist? If not, could you explain a bit?
No not a different thread but this one would but fine to do just that as it seems the concensus of the majority here have deemed the prayer and healing subject has been resolved. Well all but the white flag of surrender speach and starting the negotiations of the peace talks. It is expected these will proceed later today. Bowing

In the mean time if you could give me an idea of what your present beliefs are.
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13-04-2017, 07:16 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(13-04-2017 06:55 AM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:25 PM)Naielis Wrote:  Do you have a thread where you explain your reasons for being a theist? If not, could you explain a bit?
No not a different thread but this one would but fine to do just that as it seems the concensus of the majority here have deemed the prayer and healing subject has been resolved. Well all but the white flag of surrender speach and starting the negotiations of the peace talks. It is expected these will proceed later today. Bowing

In the mean time if you could give me an idea of what your present beliefs are.

I believe you're deluded. No, wait. You've given more than enough evidence. I know you're deluded.
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13-04-2017, 07:40 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(13-04-2017 06:55 AM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:25 PM)Naielis Wrote:  Do you have a thread where you explain your reasons for being a theist? If not, could you explain a bit?
No not a different thread but this one would but fine to do just that as it seems the concensus of the majority here have deemed the prayer and healing subject has been resolved. Well all but the white flag of surrender speach and starting the negotiations of the peace talks. It is expected these will proceed later today. Bowing

In the mean time if you could give me an idea of what your present beliefs are.

Facepalm You were asked why you are a theist and your response is to ask what the asker's beliefs are? Christ Rolleyes

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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13-04-2017, 07:53 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(13-04-2017 01:47 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  
(13-04-2017 01:04 AM)morondog Wrote:  I always wonder what happens to the ones who get spanked and run away... whether they a. then go to church and drink the wine and chew the wafer and think "Yeesh, everything I was ever told about evil atheists is TRUE", or b. they go back home and think "Fuck, I couldn't answer those questions. I wonder if what I believe is really true." My money is on a.

I'll put fifty quid on a.

Its even stevens for me, the answer is most likely A. However being a presuppositional atheist © it is my belief that even in the most rabid fundamentalist theist knows deep deep down in the part of their brain that is unobscured by bullshit that their beliefs don't really make sense and do not stand up to scrutiny.
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13-04-2017, 07:56 AM
RE: Spin-off of Why I believe
(13-04-2017 06:55 AM)A_Thinking_Theist Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:25 PM)Naielis Wrote:  Do you have a thread where you explain your reasons for being a theist? If not, could you explain a bit?
No not a different thread but this one would but fine to do just that as it seems the concensus of the majority here have deemed the prayer and healing subject has been resolved. Well all but the white flag of surrender speach and starting the negotiations of the peace talks. It is expected these will proceed later today. Bowing

In the mean time if you could give me an idea of what your present beliefs are.

It would go a long way in integrating into the community if you were to answer sincere questions honestly. Dodgy

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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