Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks
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28-06-2013, 02:58 PM (This post was last modified: 29-06-2013 11:00 AM by Carlo_The_Bugsmasher_Driver.)
Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks




What do you do in a cash strapped economy with a 70 ton Cold War era battle tank which the Army claims it has enough of?

Buy more of them, of course - to the tune of $460 million.

That's right, Congress has approved the purchase of some 60 new M1A2 Abrams main battle tanks to join a fleet of some 300 other brand new Abrams tanks, which are unused and cooking out in the Nevada desert.

Now don't get me wrong, unlike the F-35, the M1 Tank actually works. It's been the workhorse heavy armor cavalry platform for the US Army since the early 1980s. Equipped with the still classified Chobham armor combined with the 120mm smoothbore gun firing a depleted Uranium armor busting round, IR for day and night ops, and all aspect targeting and fire control while maneuvering over uneven terrain, it is an extremely formidable ground based weapons platform. While it did have some early teething issues with the turbine engine and transmission, the tank has proven itself with a stellar combat record in Iraq and, while a few have been disabled by enemy fire, no anti armor weapon has ever penetrated its think hide and injured and/or killed the crew of an Abrams.

It's just that we have over 9,000 of these tanks in our inventory and don't need to buy any more of them. In addition we have several thousand brand new Abrams tanks in storage at a military depot in Nevada. Lt. Gen. Ray Odierno, US Army, specifically asked congress to stop buying these tanks for this reason. The request has gone ignored. In 2012, Congress approved the purchase of another 60 of these tanks at $460 million. This is purely political; 2012 was an election year and tank's manufacturer, General Dynamics Land Systems, is located in Ohio, a key swing state, both for the presidential election as well as for the Senate and key House districts. So congress approved this totally unnecessary purchase both corporate welfare for General Dynamics and a jobs program for the citizens of Ohio.

If this was any other industry besides defense, this would be seen as the most outrageous goddamn example of pork barrel politics.

Up next in End The Welfare State, Vol III: How Medicare fraud is taking YOU to the cleaners.

"IN THRUST WE TRUST"

"We were conservative Jews and that meant we obeyed God's Commandments until His rules became a royal pain in the ass."

- Joel Chastnoff, The 188th Crybaby Brigade
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28-06-2013, 11:24 PM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tank Nobody Wanted
More waste of money.

The US should be dialing back it's military capabilities, not enforcing them with more and more hardware.
God, anyone would think you're gearing up for a third world war...

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29-06-2013, 05:19 AM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tank Nobody Wanted
I suggest you change the thread title to "Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tanks Nobody Wanted".

The current title implies the Abrams tank wasn't wanted.

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29-06-2013, 10:58 AM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tank Nobody Wanted
(29-06-2013 05:19 AM)Chas Wrote:  I suggest you change the thread title to "Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tanks Nobody Wanted".

The current title implies the Abrams tank wasn't wanted.

I fixed it. Tanks..er, Thanks.

"IN THRUST WE TRUST"

"We were conservative Jews and that meant we obeyed God's Commandments until His rules became a royal pain in the ass."

- Joel Chastnoff, The 188th Crybaby Brigade
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29-06-2013, 11:35 AM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks
I find it strange just how different military procurements are in America; billions will be thrown into projects without a second thought. Want to replace some planes? You are now authorized to spend $15 billion, and I don't care what you buy, how much you buy, or if you go over-budget. In Canada, something like two new ship contracts is a big thing, and we'll argue over contracts because something is several million dollars over the projected price. In America, it seems the military is something you throw tax money into without caring about how much or where it goes.

If something can be destroyed by the truth, it might be worth destroying.

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29-06-2013, 11:40 AM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks
(29-06-2013 11:35 AM)Elesjei Wrote:  I find it strange just how different military procurements are in America; billions will be thrown into projects without a second thought. Want to replace some planes? You are now authorized to spend $15 billion, and I don't care what you buy, how much you buy, or if you go over-budget. In Canada, something like two new ship contracts is a big thing, and we'll argue over contracts because something is several million dollars over the projected price. In America, it seems the military is something you throw tax money into without caring about how much or where it goes.

Thats because in America the military is one of our big 3. The US budget is divided into roughly 32% chunks for 3 items and everything else gets the remaining 3%. Medicare, Medicaid and Military budgets are the only budgets that are really important in America everything else is negligible.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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29-06-2013, 01:40 PM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tank Nobody Wanted
(29-06-2013 10:58 AM)Carlo_The_Bugsmasher_Driver Wrote:  
(29-06-2013 05:19 AM)Chas Wrote:  I suggest you change the thread title to "Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tanks Nobody Wanted".

The current title implies the Abrams tank wasn't wanted.

I fixed it. Tanks..er, Thanks.

Thumbsup Well played, sir.

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29-06-2013, 01:41 PM (This post was last modified: 29-06-2013 01:44 PM by DeepThought.)
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks
(29-06-2013 11:40 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Thats because in America the military is one of our big 3. The US budget is divided into roughly 32% chunks for 3 items and everything else gets the remaining 3%. Medicare, Medicaid and Military budgets are the only budgets that are really important in America everything else is negligible.

Imagine where America would be in 15 years if 30% of the budget were dedicated to education and research. America would probably be the richest place on the planet by far.

Politicians are short sighted. Anything where the benefits take more than an election term to show and it's not considered.

“Forget Jesus, the stars died so you could be born.” - Lawrence M. Krauss
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29-06-2013, 06:13 PM
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: Tanks, but no Tanks
We should have listened.

Quote:In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.

Dwight D. Eisenhower

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29-06-2013, 07:08 PM (This post was last modified: 29-06-2013 11:49 PM by Carlo_The_Bugsmasher_Driver.)
RE: Stop the Welfare State, Vol II: The Tank Nobody Wanted
(28-06-2013 11:24 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  More waste of money.

The US should be dialing back it's military capabilities, not enforcing them with more and more hardware.
God, anyone would think you're gearing up for a third world war...

Oddly enough, we really ARE dialing back our military capabilities. Money is just being used up on expensive, useless weapons programs that aren't doing the job the were designed to do. We've lost our way since the rebuilding of the US military into an efficient war machine since the 1980s.

As an example, the US Air Force spends $10 billion more today than it did during the Cold War yet has less than half the active combat aircraft in its fleet than it did during the Cold War. We buy exotic weapons programs like F-22 and F-35 at intentionally lowballed price tags, then the development costs skyrocket and the operational costs shoot through the roof, causing the number of units to shrink and the budget for training time shrinks and money is pirated from existing programs to pay for this stuff.





While Ms. Maddow's analysis of the F-22 isn't totally accurate, the premise of this piece is pretty accurate and it's a good demonstration of what's wrong with current Pentagon Procurements.

"IN THRUST WE TRUST"

"We were conservative Jews and that meant we obeyed God's Commandments until His rules became a royal pain in the ass."

- Joel Chastnoff, The 188th Crybaby Brigade
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