Suicide
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25-02-2011, 06:54 AM
RE: Suicide
Damn , that was a very hard youth for you MasterRottweiler.
I'm glad you managed to pull through and I hope your sister can manage with the symptoms of her illness.
(I don't understand how the Mossad came to your home town , aren't you from Mexico ? )

Also , I feel this video is relevant :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DU6bc_Gsp7s

Atheism is a religion like OFF is a TV channel !!!

Proud of my genetic relatives Big Grin
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25-02-2011, 09:45 AM
RE: Suicide
I think suicide is a little selfish, like unless it's the kind you go to Switzerland for. All these terminally ill people who are forced into medication they don't want and get their passports taken away if they talk of going to a Swiss death hospital and that. The whole issue there I'm in support of legal suicide.

I've been in what you might call a "suicidal state" before, but even then I just want to break as much stuff as possible until somebody stops me with force >.>

Often suicide is pointless too, which really angers me. People killing themselves over things that don't matter. Middle class 19 year old with everything hangs himself from the stairs when his parents buy him a Voltswagon instead of an Audi (happened in my home town at least once) etc etc.

Anyways...

[Image: sigone_zps207cf92c.png]

"To the last, I grapple with thee; from Hell's heart, I stab at thee; for hate's sake, I spit my last breath at thee."
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25-02-2011, 11:21 PM
 
RE: Suicide
I am an advocate for Euthanasia, but suicide I feel is unnecessary. The way I see it, if life is SO shitty due to events in your personal life, why not just get up and go? Not go as in death, but hop on a plane/train/automobile and start off fresh somewhere with the money in your pocket. Go to some Caribbean country and live in a shack, or go to and be a fisherman or something. There is just so much out there, so many other options if you simply can't deal with your immediate circumstances.

Now I realize that it's not just that simple. I have been depressed (I'm somewhat of a loner) but I have never attempted suicide nor contemplated ideas on how to kill myself. Perhaps I just never hit rock bottem hard enough... and for that reason I can't give a 100% opinion. I do think that people who are suicidal are ill and depressed, and REQUIRE mental assistance. Counselling and/or medication to at least bring the person back to a state to think things through once again.
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25-02-2011, 11:32 PM
RE: Suicide
Suicide is a fine option to me (Not for me, when I become useless though, it will be my first choice). I never can feel sorry for a person who commits suicide though, I can only feel sorry for the people they leave behind. It drives me nuts when somebody calls someone who commits suicide a victim, it was their decision, and they got what they wanted. I'd feel more sorry for someone who attempted suicide and failed (although I have problems with sympathy in general so I probably wouldn't feel bad for them).
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26-02-2011, 11:08 AM
RE: Suicide
(25-02-2011 11:21 PM)Free_Thinker Wrote:  I am an advocate for Euthanasia, but suicide I feel is unnecessary. The way I see it, if life is SO shitty due to events in your personal life, why not just get up and go? Not go as in death, but hop on a plane/train/automobile and start off fresh somewhere with the money in your pocket. Go to some Caribbean country and live in a shack, or go to and be a fisherman or something. There is just so much out there, so many other options if you simply can't deal with your immediate circumstances..

This is actually a plan that I've given to a lot of people. Personally if I had any money in my pocket I would go and live in a third world country rather than stay how I am now. I know this idea, at least for me, originally came from suppression of suicidal thoughts.

[Image: sigone_zps207cf92c.png]

"To the last, I grapple with thee; from Hell's heart, I stab at thee; for hate's sake, I spit my last breath at thee."
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26-02-2011, 05:05 PM
RE: Suicide
Well , Euthanasia is fine and good for physical ailments.
What about psychological trauma - would you allow someone in pain to end their lives ?

Atheism is a religion like OFF is a TV channel !!!

Proud of my genetic relatives Big Grin
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26-02-2011, 05:44 PM
RE: Suicide
In case of mental suffering, I don't have a problem with killing oneself if treatment and medication doesn't help. Killing yourself is selfish when thinking of the relatives who'll be left in grief, but being alive incredibly sad and depressed can affect the relatives too, but I doubt anyone would blame one for causing grief by being alive and depressed. My father has been very depressed for years: all he does is take his medication, drink, occasionally eat something and lay on the couch or in his bed. He's on anti depressants, he's been in treatment for suicidal thoughts many times and he frequently goes to therapy. I don't see what would be wrong with him ending his suffering if he wants to.

Correct me when I'm wrong.
Accept me or go to hell.
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26-02-2011, 11:26 PM
 
RE: Suicide
With depression and/or psychological trauma I think the problem is that our minds repeat the negative thoughts/emotions in a ritualistic loop, driving us to insanity. They key is to break the loop. Kikko- to use your dad as a classic example: medication->drink->lay in bed->therapy->repeat. Perhaps the environment could be the problem. If I was forced to work in a sweatshop and got depressed no amounts of therapy or SSRIs could alter my neurotransmitters enough to make me feel happy there. Get me out of that sweatshop and I'll feel better instantly. If there is no source of income to survive aside from working in a sweatshop then get me the hell out of that country.

I realize it's easy enough to for me to just say these things, and I am privileged to live in Canada where as long as I am not incarcerated I am theoretically free to do what I please. I understand that suicidal thoughts are a symptom of depression which is a DISEASE, but just as radiation or chemotherapy is a common way to break the loop of a cancerous death, I believe there are ways to interrupt the loop of suicidal thoughts and towards "reprogram" the brain to live a life with a different routine. Life is all about routine. The problem is that people may be too scared or think it's not possible to do something dramatically different with their life and be content doing it. (Under most circumstances) you are not forced to live in [insert town or city here] doing [whatever job you think you are suppose to have] you can do something totally different. You can be around totally different people.

When I think of suicide one of the things that comes to mind is how there is a high suicide rate in Japan (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_in_Japan some interesting facts and statistics). The fact that people there have so much socioeconomic pressure, that suicide is the leading cause of death in young adults is dumbfounding! I can understand people who have been in a war and seen horrible things, or someone who has lost their entire family in a house fire, or something to tragic that the memories and images will haunt them forever- I can understand them wanting relief from this life of pure hell- I would almost consider it Euthanasia. But to jump off a bridge because you are of average intelligence and can not get such-and-such job, that is pathetic in my opinion.
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27-02-2011, 08:27 AM
RE: Suicide
In Japan it's still a common thought that if you don't want to live you should kill yourself, just don't endanger others in the process. Comparing any place to Japan is ludicrous, because they have a vastly different opinion of what suicide is. If it were just the pressure of society it wouldn't be as prevalent as it is there, it is also the fact that it is not viewed as wrong. Yes many average students kill themselves because their families will be embarassed by their mediocre lives, but using Japan in discussion with the views of other places is ludicrous because most people are not saying we should be like Japan.

One of the main reasons that there are so many people who have horrible lives in many places is because there are so many people. There are places where willful deaths are common parts of a society in order to help control the population. This is not commonplace among the world, nor has anyone been discussing this.

As far as stating (for example) that I can just leave explain to me how I leave, at the moment I don't have a car and I have $40. Getting anywhere far would cost more than $40, and at the same time I would need to have nourishment. I live in a disparaging household with family because I know that if I leave I will instead be homeless. There are plenty of cases where people can't leave. For example the prostitute whose life is controlled by her pimp has two choices in life. Have sex and give the asshole money, or die. Sure in some cases there is help to change an environment, but that is not something that happens often. People aren't just generous with those who don't quite fit the system. Moving and getting a new perspective can help, but for most people who have these thoughts that would require someone else to afford it for them. And how do you know the first move will be to anything better than what was left?

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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27-02-2011, 08:47 AM
 
RE: Suicide
Suicide is suicide, how does Japan's view on it make it any different? If you are trying to imply that I think suicide it morally or ethically wrong that is not the case, I just think it is a premature waste of the human experience. So whatever you or people in Japan or people anywhere else in the world think of suicide is irrelevant to me. Is Christianity any less ludicrous in the US because the majority of people believe in it there? Christianity is Christianity.

I understand that there is not always a second place to go that will magically make things better, but at least it's giving it a second try and not giving up. $40 is almost enough for a bus ticket. Perhaps being homeless is a better option then being in an abusive situation, it's all about perspective.
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