Taking evolution: your inner fish course
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03-07-2014, 04:41 PM
Taking evolution: your inner fish course
So I started my next semester, taking two accelerated courses as usual, one Criminal Justice based, and one science this time. The science class is evolution, your inner fish. The initial postings in the discussion area just make you shake your head. I can't wait to see these religious tools get backhanded with science. We had to posit two reasons why people don't accept evolution. Here was my post...

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Why do you think many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution? Provide at least two reasons THEN critique your reasoning by finding a source that backs up your thoughts.



The first reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to belief in a supernatural causal effect. If for example, one subscribes to one of the anthropocentric Abrahamic faiths, say for example Christianity, and then points to the Bible as argument from authority to explain the real world around us, and from whence we came, this prevents the believer from accepting empirical evidence of a scientific nature to explain life. Since religious belief requires faith, and faith is the belief in something without evidence, faith is a failed methodology in which to comprehend the inner workings of the world around us.

If a belief is based on insufficient evidence; than any further conclusion drawn from the belief will at best be of questionable value. This cannot point one to the path of truth. As a tool, as an epistemology, as a method of reasoning, as a process for knowing the world, faith cannot adjudicate between competing claims. The ONLY way to figure out which claims about the world are likely true, and which are likely false, is through reason and evidence. There is no other way….yet.

“Science is the antithesis of faith. Science is a process that contains multiple and redundant checks, balances, and safeguards against human bias and error. Science has a built in corrective mechanism..hypothesis testing...that weeds out false claims. Claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are held as tentatively true by scientists..unlike claims of faith that are held as eternally true with zero evidence. Related to this, claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are falsifiable, that is, there is a way to show the claims are false. This is not the case with faith claims. For example, there's no way to falsify the claim that the Norse god Loki was able to assume other forms.

Scientists try to prove claims false (falsification), unlike faith leaders who unequivocally state their faith claims are true. If a scientist can demonstrate that a popular scientific claim is false, he or she can become famous, get tenure, publish books, earn more money and become respected by her or his peers. If a preacher states that the claims of his faith tradition are false, he's excommunicated, defrocked or otherwise forced to abandon his position”(Boghossian 2013)...the stifling of growth and enlightenment basically.

Science is a method for advancing our understanding. It is process we can use to bring us closer to the truth, and to weed out false claims. Science thus is the best way we've currently found to explain and understand how the universe works. This doesn’t set well with those who clutch supernatural, extraordinary, and unprovable theological faith claims, and that is a problem as it not only impacts their ability to understand and accept basic scientific principles, but it actually creates a barrier to moving on to better methods of epistemology. The reason creationism is not taught in public school is because it lacks any evidence. There is a good reason evolution is taught in public school, it is because it has evidence.

A second reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to lack of education and understanding of scientific methods. The problem comes with the word theory, those unfamiliar with scientific terms think that theory is something, “not quite right”, a speculation, a guess, and very likely wrong.

“According to the Oxford English dictionary, a scientific theory is “a statement of what are held to be the general laws, principles, or causes of something known or observed.” (Coyne 2009) in science, a theory is much more than just a speculation about how things are: it is a well thought out group of propositions meant to explain facts about the real world.”

I believe it is due to lack of understanding of the plethora of empirical and scientific evidence proving evolution that prevents some from accepting it.




Works Cited

Boghossian, P. (2013) A manual for creating atheists. Durham: Pitchstone Publishing

Coyne, J. (2009) Why evolution is true. London: Penguin Books Ltd.

------------------------------------------------------

Thoughts? comments? lol, I wish you could see the drivel being posted, here is one, I will remove her name of course...

In my opinion, I feel that many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution because all of creation could not have happened without a creator. The Bible is a great source which accounts for earth’s creation in Genesis 1:1-31. It is explained how God created the heaven and earth and it goes on to include all of creation and how it came about. The second reason I think many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution is because life is unable to derive directly from non-living matter which is proven in the scientific fact of The Law of Biogenesis. The Law of Biogenesis, attributed to Louis Pasteur, is the observation that living things come only from other living things, by reproduction.

Works Cited
In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood. (2014, July 03). Retrieved from Center for Scientific Creation: http://www.creationscience.com/onlineboo...nces4.html

The Holy Bible. (1987). Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc.

Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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03-07-2014, 04:48 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 04:41 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  So I started my next semester, taking two accelerated courses as usual, one Criminal Justice based, and one science this time. The science class is evolution, your inner fish. The initial postings in the discussion area just make you shake your head. I can't wait to see these religious tools get backhanded with science. We had to posit two reasons why people don't accept evolution. Here was my post...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Why do you think many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution? Provide at least two reasons THEN critique your reasoning by finding a source that backs up your thoughts.



The first reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to belief in a supernatural causal effect. If for example, one subscribes to one of the anthropocentric Abrahamic faiths, say for example Christianity, and then points to the Bible as argument from authority to explain the real world around us, and from whence we came, this prevents the believer from accepting empirical evidence of a scientific nature to explain life. Since religious belief requires faith, and faith is the belief in something without evidence, faith is a failed methodology in which to comprehend the inner workings of the world around us.

If a belief is based on insufficient evidence; than any further conclusion drawn from the belief will at best be of questionable value. This cannot point one to the path of truth. As a tool, as an epistemology, as a method of reasoning, as a process for knowing the world, faith cannot adjudicate between competing claims. The ONLY way to figure out which claims about the world are likely true, and which are likely false, is through reason and evidence. There is no other way….yet.

“Science is the antithesis of faith. Science is a process that contains multiple and redundant checks, balances, and safeguards against human bias and error. Science has a built in corrective mechanism..hypothesis testing...that weeds out false claims. Claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are held as tentatively true by scientists..unlike claims of faith that are held as eternally true with zero evidence. Related to this, claims that come about as a result of a scientific process are falsifiable, that is, there is a way to show the claims are false. This is not the case with faith claims. For example, there's no way to falsify the claim that the Norse god Loki was able to assume other forms.

Scientists try to prove claims false (falsification), unlike faith leaders who unequivocally state their faith claims are true. If a scientist can demonstrate that a popular scientific claim is false, he or she can become famous, get tenure, publish books, earn more money and become respected by her or his peers. If a preacher states that the claims of his faith tradition are false, he's excommunicated, defrocked or otherwise forced to abandon his position”(Boghossian 2013)...the stifling of growth and enlightenment basically.

Science is a method for advancing our understanding. It is process we can use to bring us closer to the truth, and to weed out false claims. Science thus is the best way we've currently found to explain and understand how the universe works. This doesn’t set well with those who clutch supernatural, extraordinary, and unprovable theological faith claims, and that is a problem as it not only impacts their ability to understand and accept basic scientific principles, but it actually creates a barrier to moving on to better methods of epistemology. The reason creationism is not taught in public school is because it lacks any evidence. There is a good reason evolution is taught in public school, it is because it has evidence.

A second reason why many in the general public doubt the theory of evolution is due to lack of education and understanding of scientific methods. The problem comes with the word theory, those unfamiliar with scientific terms think that theory is something, “not quite right”, a speculation, a guess, and very likely wrong.

“According to the Oxford English dictionary, a scientific theory is “a statement of what are held to be the general laws, principles, or causes of something known or observed.” (Coyne 2009) in science, a theory is much more than just a speculation about how things are: it is a well thought out group of propositions meant to explain facts about the real world.”

I believe it is due to lack of understanding of the plethora of empirical and scientific evidence proving evolution that prevents some from accepting it.




Works Cited

Boghossian, P. (2013) A manual for creating atheists. Durham: Pitchstone Publishing

Coyne, J. (2009) Why evolution is true. London: Penguin Books Ltd.

------------------------------------------------------

Thoughts? comments? lol, I wish you could see the drivel being posted, here is one, I will remove her name of course...

In my opinion, I feel that many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution because all of creation could not have happened without a creator. The Bible is a great source which accounts for earth’s creation in Genesis 1:1-31. It is explained how God created the heaven and earth and it goes on to include all of creation and how it came about. The second reason I think many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution is because life is unable to derive directly from non-living matter which is proven in the scientific fact of The Law of Biogenesis. The Law of Biogenesis, attributed to Louis Pasteur, is the observation that living things come only from other living things, by reproduction.

Works Cited
In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood. (2014, July 03). Retrieved from Center for Scientific Creation: http://www.creationscience.com/onlineboo...nces4.html

The Holy Bible. (1987). Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc.

Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load

This is really an american thing, makes me mad I have to live here.

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03-07-2014, 05:41 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 04:41 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  So I started my next semester
...
I wish you could see the drivel being posted, here is one, I will remove her name of course...
...

I thought you were a navy-type. Why are you still at junior school?

Or, I have that wrong, why is there a 6-year-old girl at your big school?

Huh

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03-07-2014, 06:00 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 05:41 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 04:41 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  So I started my next semester
...
I wish you could see the drivel being posted, here is one, I will remove her name of course...
...

I thought you were a navy-type. Why are you still at junior school?

Or, I have that wrong, why is there a 6-year-old girl at your big school?

Huh

I know right? I am chomping at the bit to dismantle her idiocy, but since this is class, I have to do it artfully, positing countering information and practicing civility at the same time. Facepalm

good experience though hehe

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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03-07-2014, 06:04 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 06:00 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 05:41 PM)DLJ Wrote:  I thought you were a navy-type. Why are you still at junior school?

Or, I have that wrong, why is there a 6-year-old girl at your big school?

Huh

I know right? I am chomping at the bit to dismantle her idiocy, but since this is class, I have to do it artfully, positing countering information and practicing civility at the same time. Facepalm

good experience though hehe

I can help if you need some.

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03-07-2014, 06:12 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 06:04 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 06:00 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  I know right? I am chomping at the bit to dismantle her idiocy, but since this is class, I have to do it artfully, positing countering information and practicing civility at the same time. Facepalm

good experience though hehe

I can help if you need some.

Yeah to be honest I am not as fluent in science as I should be, and while I know bio-genesis has since been debunked by several experiments since louis' time, I am not knowedgeable enough to weigh in with substantive countering facts. No worries, my wife just finished this course last semester, and when i showed her this lady's comment she just laughed and said she is due for a serious wake up call when she does this course. So I assume it will all come out in the long run Smartass

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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03-07-2014, 06:21 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 06:12 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 06:04 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  I can help if you need some.

Yeah to be honest I am not as fluent in science as I should be, and while I know bio-genesis has since been debunked by several experiments since louis' time, I am not knowedgeable enough to weigh in with substantive countering facts. No worries, my wife just finished this course last semester, and when i showed her this lady's comment she just laughed and said she is due for a serious wake up call when she does this course. So I assume it will all come out in the long run Smartass

Well you are a smart guy I know you will complete this quickly and correctly. When you are done are you going to post it in a thread or hear. When ever you are done tell me, it seems to be great that I am not the only one here debunking creationist crap(even though I have not done it in a while)

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03-07-2014, 06:54 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 06:21 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 06:12 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  Yeah to be honest I am not as fluent in science as I should be, and while I know bio-genesis has since been debunked by several experiments since louis' time, I am not knowedgeable enough to weigh in with substantive countering facts. No worries, my wife just finished this course last semester, and when i showed her this lady's comment she just laughed and said she is due for a serious wake up call when she does this course. So I assume it will all come out in the long run Smartass

Well you are a smart guy I know you will complete this quickly and correctly. When you are done are you going to post it in a thread or hear. When ever you are done tell me, it seems to be great that I am not the only one here debunking creationist crap(even though I have not done it in a while)

I love taking religious courses, and enjoy dismantling their position with facts, reason and logic. They are at a distinct disadvantage as they believe in a fabricated fairy tale. I hone my skills there, plus in order to be able to dismantle the enemy, one must understand them and their perspective. All the better to tear it down. I am sure some funny stuff will come out through the course in the discussions. Anything especially droll I will add to this thread. Drooling

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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03-07-2014, 07:28 PM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 06:54 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 06:21 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  Well you are a smart guy I know you will complete this quickly and correctly. When you are done are you going to post it in a thread or hear. When ever you are done tell me, it seems to be great that I am not the only one here debunking creationist crap(even though I have not done it in a while)

I love taking religious courses, and enjoy dismantling their position with facts, reason and logic. They are at a distinct disadvantage as they believe in a fabricated fairy tale. I hone my skills there, plus in order to be able to dismantle the enemy, one must understand them and their perspective. All the better to tear it down. I am sure some funny stuff will come out through the course in the discussions. Anything especially droll I will add to this thread. Drooling

I have not debated a creationist in forever so I forgot the feeling, it is sort of like once you debunk one, you debunked them all.

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04-07-2014, 08:46 AM
RE: Taking evolution: your inner fish course
(03-07-2014 04:41 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  Thoughts? comments? lol, I wish you could see the drivel being posted, here is one, I will remove her name of course...

In my opinion, I feel that many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution because all of creation could not have happened without a creator. The Bible is a great source which accounts for earth’s creation in Genesis 1:1-31. It is explained how God created the heaven and earth and it goes on to include all of creation and how it came about. The second reason I think many in the general public doubt the Theory of Evolution is because life is unable to derive directly from non-living matter which is proven in the scientific fact of The Law of Biogenesis. The Law of Biogenesis, attributed to Louis Pasteur, is the observation that living things come only from other living things, by reproduction.

Works Cited
In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood. (2014, July 03). Retrieved from Center for Scientific Creation: http://www.creationscience.com/onlineboo...nces4.html

The Holy Bible. (1987). Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc.

Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load

Ha! Typical creationist. They always seem to confuse abiogenesis and evolution. Laughat Since there is no counter-evidence to dismantle evolution, they always try to play the "creator" card without even realizing that the Theory of Evolution makes no assertions as to how life began, but merely as how it changes.

It sounds like your professor likes to stir up some shit to flush out the religitards. Nice.

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