Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
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16-10-2015, 12:54 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(16-10-2015 12:40 PM)jason_delisle Wrote:  
Thump Wrote:Death is still the penalty even for those who have accepted Jesus's alleged sacrifice and redemption.

What difference, then, is there between believing and not believing, aside from a putative punishment in the afterlife which has yet to be demonstrated?

I apologize but I am not quite sure I understand your question. Could you explain a little more please.

Christians who have been absolved of sin by their acceptance of the sacrifice of Jesus still die. Yet you've said that that sacrifice absolves them of their sin.

If the wages of sin are death, then either the sacrifice of Jesus doesn't redeem the believer of sin, or Christians live eternally. Yet they don't. They die.

What difference is there between believing and not believing when the wages of sin are meted out equally to both groups?
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16-10-2015, 02:03 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(16-10-2015 12:03 PM)jason_delisle Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 12:00 PM)unfogged Wrote:  No, the problem is that you accept that people deserve to be beaten. Your religion is based on monstrously immoral precepts. No amount of shellac over it will cover the fact that the core ideology is horrifying.
Not at all. Women do not deserved to be beaten. It is just not grounds for divorce. The wife should get away from him and pray for him. Like I said read the instructions of a husband on ephesians 5.

The quote was "Technically according to the bible, the boys deserved to be beaten for their sin" so I don't know where women and divorce are coming into the picture. This was in regard to the teens that were beaten to death because they had "sinned" and that is quite in line with xian beliefs.

Even liberal xians who have set aside most of the OT because they are more moral than their god commonly still hold to the dogma that humans are "fallen" and that they are sinful and corrupt. Many, if not most, will say that we all deserve eternal torture and it is only god's mercy that gives us an out. You may want to sweep it aside as only be "technically" true but it is still central to the religion.

It is beyond despicable that anybody believes that or teaches it to children.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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16-10-2015, 02:57 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(16-10-2015 02:03 PM)unfogged Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 12:03 PM)jason_delisle Wrote:  Not at all. Women do not deserved to be beaten. It is just not grounds for divorce. The wife should get away from him and pray for him. Like I said read the instructions of a husband on ephesians 5.

The quote was "Technically according to the bible, the boys deserved to be beaten for their sin" so I don't know where women and divorce are coming into the picture. This was in regard to the teens that were beaten to death because they had "sinned" and that is quite in line with xian beliefs.

Even liberal xians who have set aside most of the OT because they are more moral than their god commonly still hold to the dogma that humans are "fallen" and that they are sinful and corrupt. Many, if not most, will say that we all deserve eternal torture and it is only god's mercy that gives us an out. You may want to sweep it aside as only be "technically" true but it is still central to the religion.

It is beyond despicable that anybody believes that or teaches it to children.
Please read the rest of the forum. You would realize that I was answering somebody's question and it involved divorce.
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16-10-2015, 03:53 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
No pain, no gain. Thumbsup

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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16-10-2015, 04:13 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(16-10-2015 02:57 PM)jason_delisle Wrote:  Please read the rest of the forum. You would realize that I was answering somebody's question and it involved divorce.

Except that your "answer" was posted as a reply to my post which had nothing to do with that conversation. Sorry you can't keep up.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
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16-10-2015, 07:34 PM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
I'm looking forward to your answer, Jason.
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17-10-2015, 09:24 AM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(16-10-2015 07:34 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  I'm looking forward to your answer, Jason.
Sorry for the late reply. The death christian are saved from is not the physical death that you are speaking of. It is spiritual death. Revelation 20 will explain this. Now it is also important to understand that Christians believe that the spirit is immortal so the spirit never truly dies. Rather if a soul is sent to hell it is constantly dying for all eternity. It will endure the pains of death but will never see it. I hope this clears some confusion bit I don't expect it to change your opinion on the topic.
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17-10-2015, 11:16 AM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
(17-10-2015 09:24 AM)jason_delisle Wrote:  Sorry for the late reply. The death christian are saved from is not the physical death that you are speaking of. It is spiritual death. Revelation 20 will explain this. Now it is also important to understand that Christians believe that the spirit is immortal so the spirit never truly dies. Rather if a soul is sent to hell it is constantly dying for all eternity. It will endure the pains of death but will never see it. I hope this clears some confusion bit I don't expect it to change your opinion on the topic.

Here's what you wrote that aroused my reply, which started this conversation:

(16-10-2015 10:46 AM)jason_delisle Wrote:  Because according to Christians everyone is a sinner and all sin carries the same penalty...death. If we only focused on the law in the old testament everyone (including Christians should be put to death. The penalty for adultery in the old testament was stoning to death.

You were clearly writing in the context of physical death. Now in order to rescue your point point you're appealing to "spiritual death", whatever that is.

Sorry, you're moving the goalposts. I'm not interested in chasing down increasingly vague claims.
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17-10-2015, 11:27 AM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
Where did I ever say that Christians will never die here on earth and will become immortal like the highlander?
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17-10-2015, 11:30 AM
RE: Teen Beaten to Death in New York Church
If you believe this is what is really taught in Christianity please show me one scripture in the bible that says this to be true. If you do i will apologize and admit that the bible is wrong and since as a Christian I am to believe the whole bible is true I would then be forced to renounce my faith. But I don't think you really care about my opinions or beliefs enough to really do that. I am just saying to please open my eyes and prove me wrong.
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