Terrorist citizens.
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23-06-2015, 11:28 PM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(23-06-2015 11:09 PM)Banjo Wrote:  So they'll be forever stuck in a Tom Hanks movie?

IIRC there's one (true story) about a guy who spends years in an airport 'cos the authorities won't let him stay or go.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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23-06-2015, 11:40 PM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(23-06-2015 10:57 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  I disagree with the law. For one, it oversteps the Legislature's bound and incorporates one of the rolls of the Judiciary, an act made made more grievous as the government would not be held to a trial, they could just do it.

I agree that the defendant ought to be able to try the process and appeal a decision.

But if the state can prove its case, I think it's only right to disenfranchise the citizen. You ought not enjoy the privileges of a state when you've renounced loyalty to, or taken up arms against, it.
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24-06-2015, 12:31 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(23-06-2015 11:28 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(23-06-2015 11:09 PM)Banjo Wrote:  So they'll be forever stuck in a Tom Hanks movie?

IIRC there's one (true story) about a guy who spends years in an airport 'cos the authorities won't let him stay or go.

Yeah I have heard about that guy. How does he eat?

As for the Govt's decision? I will be honest. I hate this government with a passion. Government of right wing flat earthers if ever there was one. However, I dislike ISIS even more. Someone goes to support those mother fuckers ought to be shot. Fuck those medievalist bloodthirsty clowns!

There's plenty of great whites off the coast.....

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24-06-2015, 12:52 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(23-06-2015 11:40 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  You ought not enjoy the privileges of a state when you've renounced loyalty to, or taken up arms against, it.

And now comes Ozzie dictator who says "X person I don't like has renounced loyalty to the state". IMO Too subjective and too easily subverted. Who decides what organizations membership of constitutes treason? ISIS? Sure I'll give you that. Freemasons? Jehovah's witnesses? Islamic charities? Neo-nazi groups?

It seems like a tool that in the wrong hands could easily result in suppression of freedom of speech, expression etc.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-06-2015, 01:08 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(24-06-2015 12:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(23-06-2015 11:40 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  You ought not enjoy the privileges of a state when you've renounced loyalty to, or taken up arms against, it.

And now comes Ozzie dictator who says "X person I don't like has renounced loyalty to the state". IMO Too subjective and too easily subverted. Who decides what organizations membership of constitutes treason? ISIS? Sure I'll give you that. Freemasons? Jehovah's witnesses? Islamic charities? Neo-nazi groups?

It seems like a tool that in the wrong hands could easily result in suppression of freedom of speech, expression etc.

Except that 'loyalty renouncement' isn't catered for in either the original law or the proposed; they refer specifically to duel-citizens who have taken up arms against Australia by joining a foreign military body at war with Australia.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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24-06-2015, 03:41 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(23-06-2015 08:41 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(23-06-2015 07:11 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  This is a horrible idea. This is a real slippery slope, if they can declare citizenship invalid for this how long before other crimes get this treatment?

I don't see it that way.
There's a difference between being a terrorist/traitor and aiding a states enemies and say murdering another citizen.

Besides, kicking people out of Australia for being criminals? That's just plain un-Australian!


Yeah, the tide usually runs in the other direction. Or at least it used to.......

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24-06-2015, 08:47 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(24-06-2015 12:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(23-06-2015 11:40 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  You ought not enjoy the privileges of a state when you've renounced loyalty to, or taken up arms against, it.

And now comes Ozzie dictator who says "X person I don't like has renounced loyalty to the state". IMO Too subjective and too easily subverted. Who decides what organizations membership of constitutes treason? ISIS? Sure I'll give you that. Freemasons? Jehovah's witnesses? Islamic charities? Neo-nazi groups?

It seems like a tool that in the wrong hands could easily result in suppression of freedom of speech, expression etc.

Which is why I specifically mentioned appeals in the next post ... meaning that it should be adjudicated by the courts, in order to address that valid concern.
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24-06-2015, 08:52 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(24-06-2015 08:47 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(24-06-2015 12:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  And now comes Ozzie dictator who says "X person I don't like has renounced loyalty to the state". IMO Too subjective and too easily subverted. Who decides what organizations membership of constitutes treason? ISIS? Sure I'll give you that. Freemasons? Jehovah's witnesses? Islamic charities? Neo-nazi groups?

It seems like a tool that in the wrong hands could easily result in suppression of freedom of speech, expression etc.

Which is why I specifically mentioned appeals in the next post ... meaning that it should be adjudicated by the courts, in order to address that valid concern.

Hmm... Courts are hardly non-partisan either. Having lived under one dictator and with plenty of African dictator wannabes waiting in the wings, I tend to be *very* leery of laws where people award themselves new powers which can be used to quash dissent.

Besides, Australians fighting in ISIS? Fuck them, they're not Australians - seems like the Aussies get out of taking responsibility for clearing up the messes made by their citizens?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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25-06-2015, 08:33 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
The news today is claiming that the legislation as written not only strips citizenship from accused terrorists without trial but includes anyone who damages government property. Spray painting a fence would technically be grounds to strip someone of their citizenship.

The legislation is not framed to be an anti terrorism measure. It is framed to be a political document containing clauses so outrageous and unconstitutional that members of the opposition will be forced to argue against them. At this time the government will turn around and claim the opposition is soft on terrorism. This is literally the government's written strategy as leaked to the media.

http://m.smh.com.au/federal-politics/pol...hx6gm.html

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-new...h-property

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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25-06-2015, 08:38 AM
RE: Terrorist citizens.
(25-06-2015 08:33 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  The news today is claiming that the legislation as written not only strips citizenship from accused terrorists without trial but includes anyone who damages government property. Spray painting a fence would technically be grounds to strip someone of their citizenship.

The legislation is not framed to be an anti terrorism measure. It is framed to be a political document containing clauses so outrageous and unconstitutional that members of the opposition will be forced to argue against them. At this time the government will turn around and claim the opposition is soft on terrorism. This is literally the government's written strategy as leaked to the media.

http://m.smh.com.au/federal-politics/pol...hx6gm.html

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-new...h-property

This particular government is extremely dangerous.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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