That Damn UFO Thing
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01-12-2014, 10:53 AM (This post was last modified: 01-12-2014 12:56 PM by Free.)
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 10:41 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 10:26 AM)Free Wrote:  Okay, so the evidence in this is that 12 persons, highly experienced with aircraft, all positively claimed to have seen an aircraft of unknown origin, and all described it virtually identical. The evidence indicates that they know they seen an aircraft.

Occam's Razor clearly indicates they all know they seen an aircraft.

You have indeed made a choice. You have chosen to dispute the results of Occam's Razor.

I cannot help you if you don't like that result.

The 12 were "airport employees", including ramp personnel. You inflate their expertise and credibility.

What I don't like is your lack of objectivity.

Actually there were far more witnesses than 12. I am using 12 who have been identified as having a high level of expertise with aircraft. From pilots to mechanics, et al.

This is a persuasive argument. I have been saying that for many pages now. It is designed to demonstrate my opinion, using all available resources.

I see the objections, but most objections I have seen so far are speculations that do not actually contest the oral testimony of the eyewitnesses. Anybody can say, "Maybe it was this, " or "Maybe it was that," but has anyone here actually pointed to any real evidence to contest the oral testimony of these witnesses?

For example, how about a weather report that shows unusual weather activity at the Chicago airport?

How about a witness who observed this weather phenomenon that caused a hole in the clouds?

How about a witness who publicly recanted their original statement?

How about a few people who experienced some kind of hallucination effect at the airport that day?

How about at least 1 person who actually seen the object in the sky and positively identified it as a known aircraft?

NONE of this, or anything like it, has been presented by anybody here. Not one stitch of actual evidence to dispute the claims.

Mere speculation in the face of eyewitness testimony does not work on ANY level.

I would like actual evidence that can actually dispute these claims.

Is that too much to ask?

For the record, I have debunked so many UFO reports that I lost count. But this one? I have not been successful with debunking this one at all.

And unfortunately, neither has anyone else here actually debunked this incident. It requires credible evidence to debunk, not mere speculation.

So now you have the reasons why I defend this incident with such ferocity. I am supposed to defend it because the argument is intended and proclaimed to be a persuasive argument. Your position, and other people's position here, is to debunk this incident.

So let's see a real effort, and not a bunch of speculative bullshit.

Drinking Beverage

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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01-12-2014, 03:11 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
Still going at it huh?

I say it was an Amazon drone looking to make a delivery...about the right size Consider

With the advent of drones UFO sightings are going to go through the roof. Could the 12 eye-witnesses have seen a craft? Sure. Could it have a been a drone they couldn’t identify? Sure.

What more likely, a drone or an alien spacecraft? Occam’s Razor would lead to the former.

[Image: 131201231607-vo-amazon-drone-delivery-sy...ry-top.jpg]

[Image: BurrardLucas_Drone_2783693a.jpg]



[Image: Collisions-between-Drones-and-Airplanes.jpg]

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-12-2014, 03:15 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:11 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Still going at it huh?

I say it was an Amazon drone looking to make a delivery...about the right size Consider

With the advent of drones UFO sightings are going to go through the roof. Could the 12 eye-witnesses have seen a craft? Sure. Could it have a been a drone they couldn’t identify? Sure.

What more likely, a drone or an alien spacecraft? Occam’s Razor would lead to the former.

[Image: 131201231607-vo-amazon-drone-delivery-sy...ry-top.jpg]

[Image: BurrardLucas_Drone_2783693a.jpg]



[Image: Collisions-between-Drones-and-Airplanes.jpg]

Speculation.

8 years ago?

Over the 2nd busiest airport in the world?

Blew a hole in the clouds?

Occam's Razor ....

Consider

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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01-12-2014, 03:19 PM (This post was last modified: 01-12-2014 03:24 PM by Full Circle.)
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:15 PM)Free Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:11 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Still going at it huh?

I say it was an Amazon drone looking to make a delivery...about the right size Consider

With the advent of drones UFO sightings are going to go through the roof. Could the 12 eye-witnesses have seen a craft? Sure. Could it have a been a drone they couldn’t identify? Sure.

What more likely, a drone or an alien spacecraft? Occam’s Razor would lead to the former.

[Image: 131201231607-vo-amazon-drone-delivery-sy...ry-top.jpg]

[Image: BurrardLucas_Drone_2783693a.jpg]



[Image: Collisions-between-Drones-and-Airplanes.jpg]

Speculation.

8 years ago?

Over the 2nd busiest airport in the world?

Blew a hole in the clouds?

Occam's Razor ....

Consider

That’s the way I’d bet...anything other than an alien spacecraft.

Edit: When I Google “Air space violations over US airports” the list is endless.
Why not 8 years ago? We didn’t have drones 8 years ago?
Drone went through the clouds...pfft.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-12-2014, 03:21 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:19 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:15 PM)Free Wrote:  Speculation.

8 years ago?

Over the 2nd busiest airport in the world?

Blew a hole in the clouds?

Occam's Razor ....

Consider

That’s the way I’d bet...anything other than an alien spacecraft.

That's okay. If you want to bet on, say, an Amazon drone that didn't exist 8 years ago, who am I to argue with you?

Big Grin

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01-12-2014, 03:26 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:21 PM)Free Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:19 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  That’s the way I’d bet...anything other than an alien spacecraft.

That's okay. If you want to bet on, say, an Amazon drone that didn't exist 8 years ago, who am I to argue with you?

Big Grin

The Amazon thing was just me being funny Consider

Anyway, apparently unmanned aerial thingys have been around since before 2006
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...l_vehicles

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-12-2014, 03:31 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:26 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:21 PM)Free Wrote:  That's okay. If you want to bet on, say, an Amazon drone that didn't exist 8 years ago, who am I to argue with you?

Big Grin

The Amazon thing was just me being funny Consider

I gathered that. Hence my tongue-in-cheek response.

Quote:Anyway, apparently unmanned aerial thingys have been around since before 2006
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...l_vehicles

Possible, yes.
Practical, no, I don't think so. It would have shown up on radar.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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01-12-2014, 04:13 PM (This post was last modified: 02-12-2014 11:23 AM by Full Circle.)
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 03:31 PM)Free Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:26 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  The Amazon thing was just me being funny Consider

I gathered that. Hence my tongue-in-cheek response.

Quote:Anyway, apparently unmanned aerial thingys have been around since before 2006
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...l_vehicles

Possible, yes.
Practical, no, I don't think so. It would have shown up on radar.

Maybe, but if it was small with little if any surface area to reflect...just saying.

Finally, before I head out to dinner and a movie, it occurs to me that you might be starting out with the premise that it is an alien craft and only when that can be ruled out do you agree. I, and most others here, begin with the premise that it isn’t an alien craft and only if that could be confirmed would we agree. The problem is that there has never been 100% irrefuatble evidence for alien craft. Ever.




Ever.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-12-2014, 04:29 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 04:13 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 03:31 PM)Free Wrote:  I gathered that. Hence my tongue-in-cheek response.


Possible, yes.
Practical, no, I don't think so. It would have shown up on radar.

Maybe, but if it was small with little if any surface area to reflect...just saying.

Finally, before I head out to dinner and a movie, it occurs to me that you might be starting out with the premise that is an alien craft and only when that can be ruled out do you agree. I, and most other here, begin with the premise that it isn’t an alien craft and only when that can be confirmed would we agree. The problem is that there has never been 100% irrefuatble evidence for alien craft. Ever.




Ever.

The problem with evidence is obvious. Unless the president went on national news with an alien standing beside him no one would believe it. Even then, the "irrational" skeptics would deny it ever happened.

As humans, we tend to see things from a human perspective, naturally. We cannot assume that if aliens exist they would have a "world view" that would even closely resemble anything human.

Why would an alien civilization want to contact a human civilization? Why would they even care if anyone seen them?

If any of those UFO reports are true- pictures videos et al- then what they demonstrate to me is that aliens don't give a rat's ass if we know about them or not. They are not here to "fix the problems mankind has on earth." Their motives are self-serving.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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01-12-2014, 04:48 PM
RE: That Damn UFO Thing
(01-12-2014 04:29 PM)Free Wrote:  The problem with evidence is obvious. Unless the president went on national news with an alien standing beside him no one would believe it. Even then, the "irrational" skeptics would deny it ever happened.

As humans, we tend to see things from a human perspective, naturally. We cannot assume that if aliens exist they would have a "world view" that would even closely resemble anything human.

Why would an alien civilization want to contact a human civilization? Why would they even care if anyone seen them?

If any of those UFO reports are true- pictures videos et al- then what they demonstrate to me is that aliens don't give a rat's ass if we know about them or not. They are not here to "fix the problems mankind has on earth." Their motives are self-serving.

Oh good, it's make believe story time at the Conspiracy Hut. Add some dragons, everything is always better with dragons. Drinking Beverage

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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