That awkward moment...
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23-10-2012, 01:06 PM
That awkward moment...
...when a certified teacher confidently asserted that “evolution is just a theory”

http://theunconverted.com/that-awkward-m...-a-theory/

Damn near made me physically sick, but it also strengthened my resolve to focus my activism and volunteer efforts on providing the youth with math and science education.

That's the best way, in my opinion, to ensure that they learn how to think instead of what to think.

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23-10-2012, 01:20 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
This seems a little circular. At first I thought this was another link to some news article on a real news site but then I realized you just linked your post to your blog, creating a circular reference.

What's missing is the name of the teacher, the name of the school, what was specifically said, who it was said to, who reported the incident and are they credible or just making trouble, and who tried to straighten her out.

Or to put it another way, it's a good story, but it's a bit light on facts.

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23-10-2012, 05:15 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(23-10-2012 01:20 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  This seems a little circular. At first I thought this was another link to some news article on a real news site but then I realized you just linked your post to your blog, creating a circular reference.

What's missing is the name of the teacher, the name of the school, what was specifically said, who it was said to, who reported the incident and are they credible or just making trouble, and who tried to straighten her out.

Or to put it another way, it's a good story, but it's a bit light on facts.

I occasionally share personal blog posts with the group. Folks seem to enjoy them usually and the admins here don't mind. Sorry this one didn't have what you were looking for.

It was a pretty intense and motivational experience for me, so I figured I'd share.

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23-10-2012, 06:39 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(23-10-2012 05:15 PM)lightninlives Wrote:  I occasionally share personal blog posts with the group. Folks seem to enjoy them usually and the admins here don't mind. Sorry this one didn't have what you were looking for.

It was a pretty intense and motivational experience for me, so I figured I'd share.

Actually, I think sharing your blog posts is a great idea. This one just felt like a factless news story. I only wish it had more information, like where it was and actual quotes from the offender and the offendees.

Also, I feel your pain. My daughter had her math teacher say the same thing to her, that evolution is just a theory, and then she got in trouble for arguing the point with him and disrupting class.

"Whores perform the same function as priests, but far more thoroughly." - Robert A. Heinlein
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24-10-2012, 08:21 AM
RE: That awkward moment...
Yeah, I wouldn't share those details because I wouldn't want to adversely impact anybody's private or professional life.

The statements were made on Facebook, so anyone who is a friend of mine (like Meg, who is Seth's admin for his Facebook page) can see and read them.

The exchange seemed to strike a nerve with Redditors and with some of the folks on our Logic Speaks Facebook page.

Sorry to hear about your own personal experience. This is certainly something we need to continue opposing and eradicating.

Afterall, I believe the children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way ; )

(23-10-2012 06:39 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  
(23-10-2012 05:15 PM)lightninlives Wrote:  I occasionally share personal blog posts with the group. Folks seem to enjoy them usually and the admins here don't mind. Sorry this one didn't have what you were looking for.

It was a pretty intense and motivational experience for me, so I figured I'd share.

Actually, I think sharing your blog posts is a great idea. This one just felt like a factless news story. I only wish it had more information, like where it was and actual quotes from the offender and the offendees.

Also, I feel your pain. My daughter had her math teacher say the same thing to her, that evolution is just a theory, and then she got in trouble for arguing the point with him and disrupting class.

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24-10-2012, 12:42 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(23-10-2012 06:39 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  Also, I feel your pain. My daughter had her math teacher say the same thing to her, that evolution is just a theory, and then she got in trouble for arguing the point with him and disrupting class.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity to ask the school board questions like, what qualifications does a math-teaching credential give for making pronouncements on evolutionary science, why is he doing so in a math class, and why isn't he the one getting in trouble for dragging the class off topic and then punishing the student who dared to disagree?

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24-10-2012, 01:06 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(24-10-2012 12:42 PM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(23-10-2012 06:39 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  Also, I feel your pain. My daughter had her math teacher say the same thing to her, that evolution is just a theory, and then she got in trouble for arguing the point with him and disrupting class.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity to ask the school board questions like, what qualifications does a math-teaching credential give for making pronouncements on evolutionary science, why is he doing so in a math class, and why isn't he the one getting in trouble for dragging the class off topic and then punishing the student who dared to disagree?

He was giving a math lecture about axioms and theorems and proofs and whatnot and said something like "a theorem is mathematically proven, unlike a theory which can be unproven and even disproved" and then somehow he used a evolution as an example of an unproven theory.

My daughter disagreed and he shushed her and went on with his math lecture, which was valid, then they had a private discussion after class during which she got a little heated and he wrote her up a warning for being disrespectful of the beliefs of others.

So, really, the class wasn't off topic even though the comment was off-hand and there wasn't anything he did that was actionable on my part.

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24-10-2012, 01:08 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(24-10-2012 01:06 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  ...he wrote her up a warning for being disrespectful of the beliefs of others.

I have a problem with that.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-10-2012, 01:25 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(24-10-2012 01:08 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(24-10-2012 01:06 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  ...he wrote her up a warning for being disrespectful of the beliefs of others.

I have a problem with that.

Yes, so do I. But since his write-up isn't actionable (they have a system that adds good points and deducts bad points - kinda like the Rep system on this forum - but his warning was external to that and has no disciplinary value and no impact to her scholarship) it isn't a battle worth winning.

The real issue for her is that this was a "cool" teacher, they had lots of fun discussions and she thought of him as a friend before this, but now he has explicitly told her that they are no longer friends. That's what actually hurt her the most.

But she and I had talked about this long before it happened and she was prepared for her atheism to cost her friends among this dense population of dense Mormons. Surprisingly, she's had very little in the way of lost or damaged relationships other than this one example, so it's been less of a problem for her than many other people have experienced elsewhere.

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24-10-2012, 01:28 PM
RE: That awkward moment...
(24-10-2012 01:25 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  
(24-10-2012 01:08 PM)Chas Wrote:  I have a problem with that.

Yes, so do I. But since his write-up isn't actionable (they have a system that adds good points and deducts bad points - kinda like the Rep system on this forum - but his warning was external to that and has no disciplinary value and no impact to her scholarship) it isn't a battle worth winning.

The real issue for her is that this was a "cool" teacher, they had lots of fun discussions and she thought of him as a friend before this, but now he has explicitly told her that they are no longer friends. That's what actually hurt her the most.

But she and I had talked about this long before it happened and she was prepared for her atheism to cost her friends among this dense population of dense Mormons. Surprisingly, she's had very little in the way of lost or damaged relationships other than this one example, so it's been less of a problem for her than many other people have experienced elsewhere.


He's a poor excuse for a teacher. Shameful.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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