The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
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29-01-2013, 04:09 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:07 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Considering it's Gimli, there's no debate there.
Shows how much you (don't) know. It's actually Túrin He has all that tortured hero thing going for him Angel

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29-01-2013, 04:13 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
I see both protagonists barking up the wrong tree.


Hope they can keep it polite! Bowing Laughat

"Science without religion is lame.
Religion without science is blind"_ Einstein.
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29-01-2013, 04:14 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
Muffs... ugh... you're not getting it.

Yes, I see what you're saying. Yes, I get it.

But, if you don't believe in the Bible, then the beliefs being discussed are moot. There is absolutely no discussion.

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29-01-2013, 04:17 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
Richard, I'm not labeling.

It's just simple identification.

Christians who believe in freewill are called "Arminians" and Christians who believe in election are called "Calvinist".

Predestination is a belief that from the beginning of time, God predestined those that were to be saved (the elect). This means that a person has no bearing on their salvation and cannot "choose" to be saved. God chose those that would be saved.

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29-01-2013, 04:17 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:14 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Muffs... ugh... you're not getting it.

Yes, I see what you're saying. Yes, I get it.

But, if you don't believe in the Bible, then the beliefs being discussed are moot. There is absolutely no discussion.
But K/C how do you see your interpretations superior to your opponents, when you are essentially both coming from the same base? And vice versa?

"Science without religion is lame.
Religion without science is blind"_ Einstein.
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29-01-2013, 04:19 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
I think you are trying to drag me into a theological debate KC. I dont believe in theology, nor religion. Jesus wasnt a theologian nor did He begin a religion. Man made up religion and debate theology. God (Jesus) is reality. He is not bound by your opinions nor by your doctrines. God inspired the Bible as a very simple instrument that can be understood by anyone that reads and studies it, prayerfully. Unfortunately, "theologians" are like lawyers and want to tear ever little bit of the Bible to fit their preconceived ideas. God didnt write the Bible for "wise" men (that's why I posted the verses on how God feels about "wise" men). God does things thru the lowest of mankind so that you wise men can't arrogantly proclaim yourselves wise where God is concerned. Jesus didnt come the first time as royalty, He came as a little baby in a poor family from a backwater town. Jesus didnt choose priests, pharisees and sadducees as his disciples, He chose simple fishermen. He used the poor, the lame, the blind, prostitutes and thieves to prove his Gospel. I'm not trying to insult you here but you guys are all too wise for your own good. I have met men working in charcoal plants and saw mills that have more wisdom than you. You are so impressed with yourselves, your accoplishments, your big words and your verbosity (lol) that you cant possibly learn the truth. Yes, you have your truth and I have mine but one day you will learn the real truth and it will be too late.
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29-01-2013, 04:19 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:17 PM)Mr Woof Wrote:  
(29-01-2013 04:14 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Muffs... ugh... you're not getting it.

Yes, I see what you're saying. Yes, I get it.

But, if you don't believe in the Bible, then the beliefs being discussed are moot. There is absolutely no discussion.
But K/C how do you see your interpretations superior to your opponents, when you are essentially both coming from the same base? And vice versa?
I don't see any superiority. I was just offering insights and willing to discuss the opposing beliefs.

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29-01-2013, 04:24 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:17 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Richard, I'm not labeling.

It's just simple identification.

Christians who believe in freewill are called "Arminians" and Christians who believe in election are called "Calvinist".

Predestination is a belief that from the beginning of time, God predestined those that were to be saved (the elect). This means that a person has no bearing on their salvation and cannot "choose" to be saved. God chose those that would be saved.

Called by whom KC? You? Who are you to label me? Why do you have a need to label me? I am identified as Richard Stuckmeyer, that is sufficient.
I disagree with predestination then because God knew from the beginning who would and would not believe. He did not take away their free will, He just knew the end of the game.
You sure try to make salvation difficult. You are just like the priest, pharicees and sadducees that tried to make salvation difficult for the Jews. Shame on you KC.
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29-01-2013, 04:25 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:19 PM)Richard Stuckmeyer Wrote:  I think you are trying to drag me into a theological debate KC. I dont believe in theology, nor religion. Jesus wasnt a theologian nor did He begin a religion. Man made up religion and debate theology. God (Jesus) is reality. He is not bound by your opinions nor by your doctrines. God inspired the Bible as a very simple instrument that can be understood by anyone that reads and studies it, prayerfully. Unfortunately, "theologians" are like lawyers and want to tear ever little bit of the Bible to fit their preconceived ideas. God didnt write the Bible for "wise" men (that's why I posted the verses on how God feels about "wise" men). God does things thru the lowest of mankind so that you wise men can't arrogantly proclaim yourselves wise where God is concerned. Jesus didnt come the first time as royalty, He came as a little baby in a poor family from a backwater town. Jesus didnt choose priests, pharisees and sadducees as his disciples, He chose simple fishermen. He used the poor, the lame, the blind, prostitutes and thieves to prove his Gospel. I'm not trying to insult you here but you guys are all too wise for your own good. I have met men working in charcoal plants and saw mills that have more wisdom than you. You are so impressed with yourselves, your accoplishments, your big words and your verbosity (lol) that you cant possibly learn the truth. Yes, you have your truth and I have mine but one day you will learn the real truth and it will be too late.
You are looking down on intelligence and education? Huh

I'm not trying to drag you into a theological debate. You said you had opinions on Calvinists, which you alluded were negative, so I wanted to discuss this with you.

You're unwilling to do so, obviously. You're also unwilling to learn and discuss more in depth what the Bible says. You disguise it as veiled insults; however, it seems to be that you are intimidated and lazy.

There wasn't ever going to be a debate; just simple discussion.

You have no idea how much wisdom I have. You've had very limited interactions with you. I simply wanted to help you grow and discuss interesting topics with you.

If that's insulting to you, you might want to reevaluate how you view others.

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29-01-2013, 04:25 PM
RE: The Arminianism vs Calvinism (freewill vs election) Debate and Discussion Thread
(29-01-2013 04:19 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(29-01-2013 04:17 PM)Mr Woof Wrote:  But K/C how do you see your interpretations superior to your opponents, when you are essentially both coming from the same base? And vice versa?
I don't see any superiority. I was just offering insights and willing to discuss the opposing beliefs.
Good open debate is rare and admirable. Thumbsup

Richard, is there any place for the doctrine of reincarnation in your views as to Christ's teachings?

"Science without religion is lame.
Religion without science is blind"_ Einstein.
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