The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
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15-08-2014, 10:00 PM
Re: RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(15-08-2014 08:22 PM)hbl Wrote:  In Matthew 25, Jesus claimed that He alone will come back at the end of the world and be the Judge of ALL men:

“When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him; He will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.”

For a man to be excluded from Heaven on the last day, all that will be needed is for Jesus to say, “I never knew you.”

“And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practice lawlessness.” (Matthew 7:23).

In John 10:30-33, Jesus said,

“I and the Father are One [In Greek, “one” is neuter–not one person, or one in thinking, but one in essence or nature].’ The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered, ‘I showed you many good works from the Father, for which of these are you stoning me?’ The Jews answered Him, ‘For a good work we do not stone you, but for blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself out to be God.”

John 1:1-3; 14 says:

“In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.... And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.”

You said when we die, God judges us.

So when Jesus comes back he'll judge every man? Seems this process is full of redundancies if Jesus is rejudging those in heaven and hell already.

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15-08-2014, 10:30 PM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(15-08-2014 03:28 PM)hbl Wrote:  Also, in a naturalistic only world these murders and rapes take place, but in that context they are acceptable?

No, they are not acceptable. They cause harm and pain.

From your POV, however, we aren't in a "naturalistic only world" -- If you really are a believer, then you believe that murders and rapes are taking place in a universe ruled and controlled by your god.

A god that watches these things happening, but does nothing at all to stop them.

In a world with no gods, there will unfortunately be people who abuse their neighbours, and the conscientious people of the community will continue to seek ways to stop the abusers.

In a world ruled by a supposedly omniscient and omnipotent being, a god that observes evil but doesn't even tell the lowly humans that there's a crime in progress is an accessory to that crime.
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15-08-2014, 10:31 PM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
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16-08-2014, 12:25 AM (This post was last modified: 16-08-2014 12:32 AM by hbl.)
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(15-08-2014 10:30 PM)Astreja Wrote:  In a world ruled by a supposedly omniscient and omnipotent being, a god that observes evil but doesn't even tell the lowly humans that there's a crime in progress is an accessory to that crime.

If God told us when a crime would happen, how would He convey that message? Does He ring us by cell phone to the police and give the location?

There is something weird about that because we didn't have telephones until just recently. So let's go back 500 years. How would God tell us something bad was going to happen? I am curious to see what you propose should be God's way of communicating to us.

Also, is it realistic for God to tell us every crime and every bad thing that is going to happen? I'm having troubles picturing what that would look like and what kind of world that would actually be. It seems to me there is some encroachment on our free will and we would be lesser than human beings. We would be more like robots as a result which doesn't glorify God.

But maybe does tell us a crime is about to happen because a friend of the criminal knows when it will take place and does nothing. Or that criminal had a propensity for crime in high school and appropriate action was not taken by his peers and elders to deal with his condition. And who better to know than the criminal who has already been told by God what he is doing is wrong. God has communicated in all kinds of ways this crime was about to take place. But you say He doesn't tell us. He has told us in multiple different ways, but men don't listen and selfishly don't care. Being silent when you could have done something about it is itself a sin.
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16-08-2014, 12:53 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(16-08-2014 12:25 AM)hbl Wrote:  
(15-08-2014 10:30 PM)Astreja Wrote:  In a world ruled by a supposedly omniscient and omnipotent being, a god that observes evil but doesn't even tell the lowly humans that there's a crime in progress is an accessory to that crime.

If God told us when a crime would happen, how would He convey that message? Does He ring us by cell phone to the police and give the location?

There is something weird about that because we didn't have telephones until just recently. So let's go back 500 years. How would God tell us something bad was going to happen? I am curious to see what you propose should be God's way of communicating to us.

Also, is it realistic for God to tell us every crime and every bad thing that is going to happen? I'm having troubles picturing what that would look like and what kind of world that would actually be. It seems to me there is some encroachment on our free will and we would be lesser than human beings. We would be more like robots as a result which doesn't glorify God.

But maybe does tell us a crime is about to happen because a friend of the criminal knows when it will take place and does nothing. Or that criminal had a propensity for crime in high school and appropriate action was not taken by his peers and elders to deal with his condition. And who better to know than the criminal who has already been told by God what he is doing is wrong. God has communicated in all kinds of ways this crime was about to take place. But you say He doesn't tell us. He has told us in multiple different ways, but men don't listen and selfishly don't care. Being silent when you could have done something about it is itself a sin.

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16-08-2014, 12:58 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(16-08-2014 12:25 AM)hbl Wrote:  If God told us when a crime would happen, how would He convey that message? Does He ring us by cell phone to the police and give the location?

Well, in the Old Testament your god seemed to have no problems whatsoever communicating with humans, right down to how many animals of which type to put on the Ark, or how shekels a rapist had to pay to the victim's father. Maybe it could reprise its role on Mt. Sinai when it was chatting with Moses, and flash GPS coordinates in Morse code with its glowing backside. Laugh out load
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16-08-2014, 01:23 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(16-08-2014 12:58 AM)Astreja Wrote:  Well, in the Old Testament your god seemed to have no problems whatsoever communicating with humans, right down to how many animals of which type to put on the Ark, or how shekels a rapist had to pay to the victim's father. Maybe it could reprise its role on Mt. Sinai when it was chatting with Moses, and flash GPS coordinates in Morse code with its glowing backside. Laugh out load

God communicates the same way today by intuition. We are able to put words to that intuitive message by God's Spirit.

God has already given GPS coordinates in Revelation 6.12 telling us the Tribulation is going to begin 2022 and be completed 2029.

3 things are suppose to happen before the Tribulation starts:

1) Great earthquake - Haiti 2010 killed 320,000 people (2nd most deaths on record); Japan 2011 4th greatest in magnitude; back to back year over year two such massive earthquakes have never happened before on record.

2) Black sackcloth sun Nov. 3, 2013 - the 4th since Christ. Very rare indeed!

3) 2014/15 Tetrad - 8th since Christ, won't happen again till 2582/83.


Never have all 3 occurred together and in proper order - 2010 to 2015.

What follows is the construction of the 3rd Temple begins. Followed by a 7 year preparatory period followed by 7 years of famine.

Each of Daniel's 7's is 2,520 days each. There are 2,520 days from Feast of Trumpets Sept. 14, 2015 to Tisha B'Av Aug. 7, 2022. That's your preparatory period.

There are 2,550 days from Feast of Trumpets Sept. 26, 2022 to Day of Atonement Sept. 19, 2029.

The SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN (Matt. 24.30) is asteroid Apophis April 13, 2029. Then Jesus steps down on the mount of olives later that year (Zech. 14.4, Acts 1.11, Rev. 1.7).
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16-08-2014, 02:09 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(16-08-2014 01:23 AM)hbl Wrote:  
(16-08-2014 12:58 AM)Astreja Wrote:  Well, in the Old Testament your god seemed to have no problems whatsoever communicating with humans, right down to how many animals of which type to put on the Ark, or how shekels a rapist had to pay to the victim's father. Maybe it could reprise its role on Mt. Sinai when it was chatting with Moses, and flash GPS coordinates in Morse code with its glowing backside. Laugh out load

God communicates the same way today by intuition. We are able to put words to that intuitive message by God's Spirit.

God has already given GPS coordinates in Revelation 6.12 telling us the Tribulation is going to begin 2022 and be completed 2029.

3 things are suppose to happen before the Tribulation starts:

1) Great earthquake - Haiti 2010 killed 320,000 people (2nd most deaths on record); Japan 2011 4th greatest in magnitude; back to back year over year two such massive earthquakes have never happened before on record.

2) Black sackcloth sun Nov. 3, 2013 - the 4th since Christ. Very rare indeed!

3) 2014/15 Tetrad - 8th since Christ, won't happen again till 2582/83.


Never have all 3 occurred together and in proper order - 2010 to 2015.

What follows is the construction of the 3rd Temple begins. Followed by a 7 year preparatory period followed by 7 years of famine.

Each of Daniel's 7's is 2,520 days each. There are 2,520 days from Feast of Trumpets Sept. 14, 2015 to Tisha B'Av Aug. 7, 2022. That's your preparatory period.

There are 2,550 days from Feast of Trumpets Sept. 26, 2022 to Day of Atonement Sept. 19, 2029.

The SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN (Matt. 24.30) is asteroid Apophis April 13, 2029. Then Jesus steps down on the mount of olives later that year (Zech. 14.4, Acts 1.11, Rev. 1.7).

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16-08-2014, 03:27 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
I'd come back here in 2030 to make fun of how stupid you are hbl but I sincerely hope you will have been raped to death by gorilla fists long before then.

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16-08-2014, 03:31 AM
RE: The Atheist's Conversation at the Great White Throne
(16-08-2014 03:27 AM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  I'd come back here in 2030 to make fun of how stupid you are hbl but I sincerely hope you will have been raped to death by gorilla fists long before then.

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