The CS Lewis card
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20-03-2013, 07:20 PM
The CS Lewis card
I'm beginning to think that there should be an official CS Lewis fallacy. Oftentimes when a theist, online or in real life, discovers I'm an atheist, they always trot out that CS Lewis was an atheist, then he converted! I have to laugh whenever a Catholic brings out this fallacy, as they like to trump up that JRR Tolkien (who was Catholic) got Lewis to convert. They seem to forget that Lewis became Anglican...

Either way, do they really think that because a famous author converted from atheism to Christianity then became a rather ubiquitous writer about religion, we should convert too? I facepalm every time I get this beaten to the grave dead horse.

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20-03-2013, 07:29 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
Although I know all the symbolism behind Aslan. I still think Aslan was a better character than Jesus.

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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
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20-03-2013, 07:42 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
(20-03-2013 07:29 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  Although I know all the symbolism behind Aslan. I still think Aslan was a better character than Jesus.
I agree. At least the guy showed up multiple times through the history of Narnia.

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20-03-2013, 07:49 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
(20-03-2013 07:20 PM)Wolf Bird Wrote:  I'm beginning to think that there should be an official CS Lewis fallacy. Oftentimes when a theist, online or in real life, discovers I'm an atheist, they always trot out that CS Lewis was an atheist, then he converted! I have to laugh whenever a Catholic brings out this fallacy, as they like to trump up that JRR Tolkien (who was Catholic) got Lewis to convert. They seem to forget that Lewis became Anglican...

Either way, do they really think that because a famous author converted from atheism to Christianity then became a rather ubiquitous writer about religion, we should convert too? I facepalm every time I get this beaten to the grave dead horse.
Authors are in the business of selling books.

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.
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20-03-2013, 08:45 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
"I knew an atheist and he turned christian!"

"I knew a christian and he turned atheist!"

It happens on either side. It does not necessarily make an argument any more or less compelling. There is any number of reasons a person converts or deconverts.
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20-03-2013, 08:54 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
(20-03-2013 08:45 PM)Logisch Wrote:  "I knew an atheist and he turned christian!"

"I knew a christian and he turned atheist!"

It happens on either side. It does not necessarily make an argument any more or less compelling. There is any number of reasons a person converts or deconverts.
exactly..

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.
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20-03-2013, 09:19 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
As I like to say, ideas exist independently of their proponents. The validity of the theory of evolution does not hinge on the beliefs of Darwin, nor the validity of the Bible on the Pope's. How famous people feel about an idea, regardless of their level of expertise, is irrelevant.

If something can be destroyed by the truth, it might be worth destroying.

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20-03-2013, 09:23 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
Lewis was in deep grief over his wife. He never got over her death. He also was no scholar. I can't get beyond page one of anything he wrote, without objecting to eveything he says. It's really quite uninformed, scholastically. It's all built on the simplest of errors.

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20-03-2013, 09:34 PM
RE: The CS Lewis card
[projectile vomits]

Oh sorry, I meant to say, yes, I've gotten that one too, recently.

It pisses me off about as much as appeal to popularity. Just because a bunch of people believe a stupid thing, doesn't make the thing real.

Stupid relative brought up CS Lewis and some asshole Josh McDowell, as well as Pascal to me, as though I'd never heard of Lewis or Pascal (I'd never heard of the other guy, but he's really useless anyway, just a bunch of circular reasoning in his book).

But yeah, people like to say "___ converted to ____!" as if that means something, and it most certainly doesn't mean anything on its own.
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21-03-2013, 02:35 AM
RE: The CS Lewis card
The Christians have this little meme going which says that anyone who is an atheist who really really honestly digs into the scriptures etc with an open mind will find that despite all the illogical random shit, IT'S ALL TRUE!!!! and therefore will convert.

It's supported by numerous anecdotal stories and real life encounters with people who actually did follow this path, so it's an easy meme to propagate. Christian authors find it useful - one of the people I met was a lawyer type who reckoned the evidence in the gospels was enough to convict, and wrote a little (free) pdf book about it, which sure enough starts off with "I used to be very skeptical... " blah blah etc. So they bolster the meme and Christians buy the book, reinforcing their own belief that since someone very clever and atheistic has had a very deep look at it, and indeed written this hectic book all about his conversion experience and all the doubts, that they don't have to look too deeply themselves - they can trust this other guy.

Well, it works in science, we *have* to trust people for our knowledge... but Christianity or religion in general is *your life*. It's not some random "Oh wow, the Earth actually goes round the Sun, fancy that" exercise, which might get sciency types and tech people who can use that fact excited, but doesn't actually affect you, it's *your whole approach to life* which has to fit a certain pattern, if you accept the religion as true. Personally that makes me keen to check the details myself before committing.
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