The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
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24-01-2013, 04:18 PM (This post was last modified: 24-01-2013 05:57 PM by Vera.)
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
Forget I said anything...

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24-01-2013, 04:33 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
Read some John le Carré novels.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-01-2013, 04:36 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 04:50 AM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  So I'll be honest, I don't really know much about the Cold War. Growing up, I was surrounded by culture that described Russian as our evil archenemy but never really knew why. All I know is that it was the world's longest Mexican Standoff ever. Where after WW2, America and Russia just kind of stood tensely, hand on our guns, waiting for the other person to make a move.

I've heard terms used by older people that I never really knew the meaning of - like "Red China" and "commie spy." The term "mutually assured destruction" was basically coined because of the projected results if either nation attacked. I understood that there was some suspicion of Russian spies at some point in our history, but never knew why or what it was referring to. I never really knew why it was so important that America beat the Russians into space.

I'm looking to learn more about the Cold War. Does anyone have a good book suggestion? One that isn't tainted by American bias? I'm starting to wonder just how much the Cold War shaped America. Religion gained its political foothold by using a 50 year stretch of terror, where to be "without patriotism and God" was to be a communist spy, like a modern day witch hunt. The CIA was involved in jaw dropping amounts of overseas manipulation, having its hand in several regime changes in multiple countries. The entire Cuba crisis. The Korean War. We became allies with countries specifically because of their relationship with the Soviet Union, sort of like trying to get more friends on our side.

American society was soooo heavily influenced by the Cold War, and yet I never hear anyone talk about it. Like ever. There are people older than me that lived through ALL of this madness, and yet I literally never hear about it.

Cold War, discuss.
The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)??????

Seriously, reformulate the question so that it can be well understood, and then maybe we can help.
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24-01-2013, 05:33 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 04:36 PM)Julius Wrote:  The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)??????

Seriously, reformulate the question so that it can be well understood, and then maybe we can help.

The question (which was clearly stated) was: in the movie Spies Like Us, why did the US launch a nuke at their own country just to test out a missile defense system? If the system was so incomplete that it needed real life testing, doesn't that imply that there would be a high probability of failure of catastrophic results? Couldn't they have just fired a replica nuclear missile instead?

Sub-question: how can you combine the humor of Dan Aykroyd and Chevy Chase and produce such a sub-par movie?

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24-01-2013, 05:46 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 05:33 PM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  
(24-01-2013 04:36 PM)Julius Wrote:  The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)??????

Seriously, reformulate the question so that it can be well understood, and then maybe we can help.

The question (which was clearly stated) was: in the movie Spies Like Us, why did the US launch a nuke at their own country just to test out a missile defense system? If the system was so incomplete that it needed real life testing, doesn't that imply that there would be a high probability of failure of catastrophic results? Couldn't they have just fired a replica nuclear missile instead?

Sub-question: how can you combine the humor of Dan Aykroyd and Chevy Chase and produce such a sub-par movie?
What???? Are you "Playing with Yourself"?

Seriously, please ask a coherent question.
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24-01-2013, 08:02 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 11:43 AM)Chas Wrote:  What looks "way too convenient to be a coincidence"?

I just look at the Cold War, then I look at the modern day Republican party, and too me, it would look like a puzzle piece that fell straight into the laps of certain people. If you look at what I've heard called 'neoconservatism'--militaristic, right-wing, religious, patriotic--those are all views that just die over time, as people in society become more educated, more liberal, more accepting and more secular.

With that, and looking at the Cold War, I see a turtle, on its back, on the top of a fence posts, in the middle of a country road. There is all of a sudden a country that is not only seemingly powerful but that is also left-wing, and secular; and, on top of that, is making challenges to us militarily; and, on top of that, at the same time(s) in our history where those neoconservative ideas look to be fading.

Really?? So, Batman is just sitting there bored, and randomly, every time, here comes The Joker to say, "Hey, Batman, are you bored?".

But, like I said I really don't know anything about the Cold War.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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24-01-2013, 08:07 PM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 08:02 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(24-01-2013 11:43 AM)Chas Wrote:  What looks "way too convenient to be a coincidence"?

I just look at the Cold War, then I look at the modern day Republican party, and too me, it would look like a puzzle piece that fell straight into the laps of certain people. If you look at what I've heard called 'neoconservatism'--militaristic, right-wing, religious, patriotic--those are all views that just die over time, as people in society become more educated, more liberal, more accepting and more secular.

With that, and looking at the Cold War, I see a turtle, on its back, on the top of a fence posts, in the middle of a country road. There is all of a sudden a country that is not only seemingly powerful but that is also left-wing, and secular; and, on top of that, is making challenges to us militarily; and, on top of that, at the same time(s) in our history where those neoconservative ideas look to be fading.

Really?? So, Batman is just sitting there bored, and randomly, every time, here comes The Joker to say, "Hey, Batman, are you bored?".

But, like I said I really don't know anything about the Cold War.
No, you don't.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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25-01-2013, 09:47 AM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(24-01-2013 08:07 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(24-01-2013 08:02 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  I just look at the Cold War, then I look at the modern day Republican party, and too me, it would look like a puzzle piece that fell straight into the laps of certain people. If you look at what I've heard called 'neoconservatism'--militaristic, right-wing, religious, patriotic--those are all views that just die over time, as people in society become more educated, more liberal, more accepting and more secular.

With that, and looking at the Cold War, I see a turtle, on its back, on the top of a fence posts, in the middle of a country road. There is all of a sudden a country that is not only seemingly powerful but that is also left-wing, and secular; and, on top of that, is making challenges to us militarily; and, on top of that, at the same time(s) in our history where those neoconservative ideas look to be fading.

Really?? So, Batman is just sitting there bored, and randomly, every time, here comes The Joker to say, "Hey, Batman, are you bored?".

But, like I said I really don't know anything about the Cold War.
No, you don't.

When you're a kid, at a certain point, you have to stop watching Scooby Doo as if the ending isn't predetermined. Or, if you like Sherlock Holmes, you have to get past questioning how Holmes figures things out. If you realize that it was written, you can stop being bothered by details and become able to enjoy the overall entertainment value. It would not mean that you are any smarter by sometimes being able to guess along with the clues, it only means that you can think like the author. I have been at that point for some time, so even with most information, it's, for me, up to whether or not it's entertaining.

So, is there any high quality and entertaining information out there on the Cold War, that you would care to share or recommend? Hopefully, that is both accurate and isn't ruined by already knowing how things end.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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25-01-2013, 09:55 AM
RE: The Cold War (Rocky vs Drago)
(25-01-2013 09:47 AM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(24-01-2013 08:07 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, you don't.

When you're a kid, at a certain point, you have to stop watching Scooby Doo as if the ending isn't predetermined. Or, if you like Sherlock Holmes, you have to get past questioning how Holmes figures things out. If you realize that it was written, you can stop being bothered by details and become able to enjoy the overall entertainment value. It would not mean that you are any smarter by sometimes being able to guess along with the clues, it only means that you can think like the author. I have been at that point for some time, so even with most information, it's, for me, up to whether or not it's entertaining.

So, is there any high quality and entertaining information out there on the Cold War, that you would care to share or recommend? Hopefully, that is both accurate and isn't ruined by already knowing how things end.


I suggest you start here.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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