The Consolations of Atheism
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12-06-2014, 11:39 PM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 11:21 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(12-06-2014 11:00 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  I have yet to encounter a god not of the invented variety. I don't suppose you have?
Your question is somewhat loaded as I suspect you know the answer. Yes, I believe God is Love. Love is not invented.

I was referring to immortal living being possessing qualities of omniscience, omnipotence, and omnipresence. More or less the traditional monotheistic god worshiped in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.

The question isn't intended to be loaded. I sincerely want to know. Have you encountered a god along those lines?

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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12-06-2014, 11:42 PM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 11:21 PM)childeye Wrote:  ...
Yes, I believe God is Love. Love is not invented.

We've been through this a long time ago...

When defining processes and policies in governance to create clarity and remove confusion, it is best practice to avoid using two separate (and in this case contradictory) terms for the same thing.

If 'god' and 'love' are synonymous, should I start saying "I god you" when I want to get a girl in to bed?

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12-06-2014, 11:42 PM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 11:25 PM)childeye Wrote:  It is late for me. If I may speak directly, I am saying the god you are imagining is not good. No one could believe (trust) in such a god.

Again, we are agreed. Although, you seem to be suggesting that there is some other variety of god that could be believed or trusted. Is that the case?

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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12-06-2014, 11:52 PM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 11:21 PM)childeye Wrote:  I believe God is Love. Love is not invented.

In what way are the concepts of god and love the same thing?

If love is not an invention of humanity, or at least a subjective experience, does it remain after humanity is gone? If so, how?

(12-06-2014 11:21 PM)childeye Wrote:  Atheism is a contradictory reasoning based upon a misunderstanding of the term God. By an atheists definition of god, gods etc.. all True Christians are atheists.

I am an Atheist and I have not invented my own definition of what god is. I use the same one as everyone else. Since your statement here isn't the case with me, it isn't an argument you can make anymore.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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13-06-2014, 12:07 AM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 11:39 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
(12-06-2014 11:21 PM)childeye Wrote:  Your question is somewhat loaded as I suspect you know the answer. Yes, I believe God is Love. Love is not invented.

I was referring to immortal living being possessing qualities of omniscience, omnipotence, and omnipresence. More or less the traditional monotheistic god worshiped in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.

The question isn't intended to be loaded. I sincerely want to know. Have you encountered a god along those lines?
I'm sorry, your question is phrased so that I would answer yes to some of it and no to some of it. I am a Christian. By that, I mean that I see every moral/immoral choice as either sacrificing myself for others or sacrificing others for myself. In saying that, I am believing that the Christ reported in the Gospel is the True image of God because he sacrifices himself for others. When I use the term God I am referring to an absolute which is self evident in that it is the ultimate good for all men from the best objective point of view. In other words if everyone were willing to sacrifice themselves for others all would be well, while if everyone would sacrifice others for themselves, this would be bad for everyone. That is self evident to me. Therefore I trust in the Christ. Does that answer your question?
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13-06-2014, 12:41 AM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(12-06-2014 08:42 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(12-06-2014 08:27 PM)JDog554 Wrote:  I think Ricky Gervais said it best.
Atheism is a contradictory reasoning based upon a misunderstanding of the term God. By an atheists definition of god, gods etc.. all True Christians are atheists.

Really, asshole? And what are you calling a proper "understanding" of this term, moron?

Fucking fucking fuck -- Who the fuck left the screen door open and let all these fucking flies in...

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
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13-06-2014, 12:44 AM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(13-06-2014 12:07 AM)childeye Wrote:  ... if everyone were willing to sacrifice themselves for others all would be well, while if everyone would sacrifice others for themselves, this would be bad for everyone. That is self evident to me. Therefore I trust in the Christ.

Without getting into the merits of that particular outlook, it is an outlook, not a person. Trust the outlook. Attaching a personality to it (e.g. Jesus) neither detracts from nor enhances it: it stands on its own. Jesus, the mythic one or the historic one (leave aside whether either one exists or existed) is not the only personality to condone a totally altruistic outlook. Others have set better examples than Jesus in living by such an ideal. If you regard that ideal as the ideal life, have at it. Show that certain personalities accomplished things by it, certainly, but it's the ideal, not the person, that is at core. Trust the ideal. Trust the outlook. Ditch the cult of personality; the human psyche is too clotted up with conflict and inconsistency to put trust in.

With ideals, like LaPlace explained, there's no need for a god hypothesis.
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13-06-2014, 12:58 AM
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
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13-06-2014, 01:02 AM (This post was last modified: 13-06-2014 01:08 AM by childeye.)
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(13-06-2014 12:44 AM)Airportkid Wrote:  
(13-06-2014 12:07 AM)childeye Wrote:  ... if everyone were willing to sacrifice themselves for others all would be well, while if everyone would sacrifice others for themselves, this would be bad for everyone. That is self evident to me. Therefore I trust in the Christ.

Without getting into the merits of that particular outlook, it is an outlook, not a person. Trust the outlook. Attaching a personality to it (e.g. Jesus) neither detracts from nor enhances it: it stands on its own. Jesus, the mythic one or the historic one (leave aside whether either one exists or existed) is not the only personality to condone a totally altruistic outlook. Others have set better examples than Jesus in living by such an ideal. If you regard that ideal as the ideal life, have at it. Show that certain personalities accomplished things by it, certainly, but it's the ideal, not the person, that is at core. Trust the ideal. Trust the outlook. Ditch the cult of personality; the human psyche is too clotted up with conflict and inconsistency to put trust in.

With ideals, like LaPlace explained, there's no need for a god hypothesis.
Respectfully, it is not an outlook. The Spirit of Christ is real even as you have just acknowledged. It is a fact. It is not an ideal, it is the reality of morality. Hey that rhymes.
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13-06-2014, 01:05 AM (This post was last modified: 13-06-2014 01:10 AM by childeye.)
RE: The Consolations of Atheism
(13-06-2014 12:41 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  
(12-06-2014 08:42 PM)childeye Wrote:  Atheism is a contradictory reasoning based upon a misunderstanding of the term God. By an atheists definition of god, gods etc.. all True Christians are atheists.

Really, asshole? And what are you calling a proper "understanding" of this term, moron?
An absolute moral good. A single moral Truth that all men must eventually submit to.
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