The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
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26-05-2017, 09:14 AM
The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
Just thinking about how bullshit it is that the leaders and architects of the world's major religions can claim to "know" so much about not only the idea that a god exists but that his wants and needs can be known - except that they also can't.

For example they claim to know god's will, his rules for us, based on divine revelation. They KNOW, that eating certain types of food, wearing certain types of clothes, having certain types of sex and relationships are NOT god's will and deserve to be punished. They KNOW this, it has been revealed. What they can't answer is WHY the all-powerful god allows these things to exist if they're not part of his perfect plan. Why did he create shrimp cocktail if our eating it is not part of his plan?

Yet at the very same time they will claim that one of the main reasons we should worship this god is that he is SO wise, and SO complex, and SO multi-faceted that his plan and his design and his purpose are SO grand that we can't possibly fathom them.

It's just total hypocrisy. How can people claim to KNOW that god thinks homosexuality is wrong and that gay people should be stoned to death for their abomination, then claim out of the other side or their mouths that we have NO way to know WHY god opposes it - and if he does, why he created it in his "plan" in the first place.

How can they claim to know a game's rules without knowing it's point or objective? It almost sounds as if they're making this up as they go along, more to consolidate their own power over the long arc of history than to appease any divine score-keeper. Consider
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26-05-2017, 09:38 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
Yeah the "we can't understand god and his plan" is funny because the obvious reply is "Then how would I know what I'm supposed to do if I can't possibly understand it?"

Of course they try to combat this by saying "Just do what he says" and/or "he's revealed the right amount for us to know".....which again, how the fuck do they know?
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26-05-2017, 09:40 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
(26-05-2017 09:38 AM)ResidentEvilFan Wrote:  Yeah the "we can't understand god and his plan" is funny because the obvious reply is "Then how would I know what I'm supposed to do if I can't possibly understand it?"

Of course they try to combat this by saying "Just do what he says" and/or "he's revealed the right amount for us to know".....which again, how the fuck do they know?

"You can't understand gods plan!"
"So is my plan not to understand his plan?"
"Yes"
"well...now what?"
"carry on as you are, you clearly don't understand, which is exactly what your plan is"
"How do I get to understand?"
"You can't, because your plan is to not understand his plan"
"But I just...I need...What?!"

"I don't do magic, Morty, I do science. One takes brains, the other takes dark eye liner" - Rick
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26-05-2017, 09:41 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
Right, it's like: here's god's grocery list, we KNOW this is what he needs but we have absolutely no idea what's for dinner.
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26-05-2017, 09:53 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
(26-05-2017 09:41 AM)Mr. Boston Wrote:  Right, it's like: here's god's grocery list, we KNOW this is what he needs but we have absolutely no idea what's for dinner.

It's funny but I heard more than one sermon that actually did compare it to being given a grocery list, and how you're supposed to pick up what's on the list and not question why or what it's for.
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26-05-2017, 09:59 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
(26-05-2017 09:53 AM)ResidentEvilFan Wrote:  
(26-05-2017 09:41 AM)Mr. Boston Wrote:  Right, it's like: here's god's grocery list, we KNOW this is what he needs but we have absolutely no idea what's for dinner.

It's funny but I heard more than one sermon that actually did compare it to being given a grocery list, and how you're supposed to pick up what's on the list and not question why or what it's for.
"Lord, I get why we have green beans and Potatoes on the list....but you do you need a-"
"THOU SHALT NOT QUESTIONS THE LORD"

"I don't do magic, Morty, I do science. One takes brains, the other takes dark eye liner" - Rick
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26-05-2017, 10:06 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
A while back, a delightful young lady from Zimbabwe joined us (a small group of neighbors who get together every Saturday night, mostly just to drink a lot and solve all the worlds problems), and she brought up religion and asked if everyone there believed in (the Christian) god. I always get a little bit amused here in Texas, because it always seems like a shock when they ASK, but are then completely unprepared for someone to actually say "nope ...atheist here." Of COURSE, she thought that atheists' were people who claimed to KNOW god(s) don't exist, when I corrected her, she stubbornly held that was what MOST atheists believe, even if I didn't. I told her that according to the latest pew poll, of our hundred unit condo complex, there should be at least three more of us; but of that 3-4% of people openly admitting atheism/agnosticism ...she'd be lucky to find a tenth of a percent that actually held that view, unless we were talking about a specific god.

Anyway ...she was going on about "God's plan" and telling us about what God really is (I think the topic originally started with radical Islam), and when I started pointing out inconsistencies in her reasoning ...she said as mere humans, we couldn't hope to understand, or know what God wants. When I pointed out that she had JUST BEEN TELLING US who God was and what he wanted, she was absolutely dumbfounded. Hard to say if she just couldn't come up with a response, or was just entirely too used to never being challenged on her beliefs.
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26-05-2017, 03:16 PM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
(26-05-2017 09:14 AM)Mr. Boston Wrote:  Just thinking about how bullshit it is that the leaders and architects of the world's major religions can claim to "know" so much about not only the idea that a god exists but that his wants and needs can be known - except that they also can't.

For example they claim to know god's will, his rules for us, based on divine revelation. They KNOW, that eating certain types of food, wearing certain types of clothes, having certain types of sex and relationships are NOT god's will and deserve to be punished. They KNOW this, it has been revealed. What they can't answer is WHY the all-powerful god allows these things to exist if they're not part of his perfect plan. Why did he create shrimp cocktail if our eating it is not part of his plan?

Yet at the very same time they will claim that one of the main reasons we should worship this god is that he is SO wise, and SO complex, and SO multi-faceted that his plan and his design and his purpose are SO grand that we can't possibly fathom them.

It's just total hypocrisy. How can people claim to KNOW that god thinks homosexuality is wrong and that gay people should be stoned to death for their abomination, then claim out of the other side or their mouths that we have NO way to know WHY god opposes it - and if he does, why he created it in his "plan" in the first place.

How can they claim to know a game's rules without knowing it's point or objective? It almost sounds as if they're making this up as they go along, more to consolidate their own power over the long arc of history than to appease any divine score-keeper. Consider

I can't get past the assumption that a god would care about what we do. How could an extra-dimensional being of immense power be affected in any way by what we do?

Clothing? Where we put our sexual organs? Seriously?

[Image: Nope.jpg]

To assert a god is in anyway affected by what we do is asserting this god's limitations. The limitations we see put forth in scriptures would be comical if people wouldn't take them so seriously.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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26-05-2017, 06:06 PM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
Which God? Which God's plans? The Christian God? (Are you a Communist? See Acts 4, God wants you to be a Communist.) Allah's plans? The Exalted God(s) of Mormonism? The many Gods of Voodoo? And their plans?

When all you true believers get this all settled out so all the false religions go away and you all can find a way to settle this for once and all, let us know.

When I shake my ignore file, I can hear them buzzing!

Cheerful Charlie
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27-05-2017, 12:33 AM
RE: The Contradiction and Hypocrisy of "God's Plan"
This is an excellent point and another example of how inconsistent theists have to be in order to even remotely defend their beliefs. God is perfectly comprehensible to us mere mortals whenever it's convenient for the apologists, but whenever we highlight some not-so-convenient theological implications that arise under that same assumption of divine comprehensibility, he suddenly becomes utterly beyond human comprehension. Religion has some of the most mobile goalposts ever posited.

The only sacred truth in science is that there are no sacred truths. – Carl Sagan
Sōla vēritās sancta in philosophiā nātūrālī est absentia vēritātum sanctārum.
Ἡ μόνη ἱερᾱ̀ ἀληθείᾱ ἐν φυσικῇ φιλοσοφίᾳ ἐστίν ἡ ἱερῶν ἀληθειῶν σπάνις.
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