The Dawkins Scale
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19-08-2015, 05:56 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 05:11 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(19-08-2015 04:26 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I'm sorry, I didn't mean to single you out. There were several members who labeled themselves an >6, 6.9, etc. My questions were as much for them as you. The only reason I referenced your post is because you mentioned the burden of proof.

To me, the starting point for any claim is neutral. To move in either direction requires evidence. With the god claim, we don't even know what kind of evidence to look for, or what evidence would look like. I don't see any reason to move away from the neutral position.

I really enjoy your contributions, and you seem like a very smart person, and I hope you didn't take my post as an attack.

No sweat. Smile
I should have read more than the first post before I replied.I thought it was just a fun little post, I didn't see what it morphed into later.

Girly, I've read some of Alla's posts, most of them are #2. Big Grin

I think that, like you said, she also does not have any burden of proof.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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19-08-2015, 05:59 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 04:46 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  
(19-08-2015 04:26 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I'm sorry, I didn't mean to single you out. There were several members who labeled themselves an >6, 6.9, etc. My questions were as much for them as you. The only reason I referenced your post is because you mentioned the burden of proof.

To me, the starting point for any claim is neutral. To move in either direction requires evidence. With the god claim, we don't even know what kind of evidence to look for, or what evidence would look like. I don't see any reason to move away from the neutral position.

I really enjoy your contributions, and you seem like a very smart person, and I hope you didn't take my post as an attack.

What makes you state the starting point of a claim is neutral opposed to absence of claim?

I would start with no claim, but I'm not the one doing the claiming. I approach the claim with a skeptical attitude. I withhold belief and wait for evidence.

for me, no evidence = no belief

At least that's the goal.
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19-08-2015, 06:02 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 05:56 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(19-08-2015 05:11 PM)pablo Wrote:  No sweat. Smile
I should have read more than the first post before I replied.I thought it was just a fun little post, I didn't see what it morphed into later.

Girly, I've read some of Alla's posts, most of them are #2. Big Grin

I think that, like you said, she also does not have any burden of proof.

Fair enough, Thumbsup I'd rather not have that tedious, futile argument.
Now this thread has devolved into an argument over what qualifies for the argument. Facepalm
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19-08-2015, 06:23 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 06:02 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(19-08-2015 05:56 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I think that, like you said, she also does not have any burden of proof.

Fair enough, Thumbsup I'd rather not have that tedious, futile argument.
Now this thread has devolved into an argument over what qualifies for the argument. Facepalm

... arguably.

Angel

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19-08-2015, 06:25 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(18-08-2015 10:07 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You can't be an atheist, without theistic claims. Ergo, atheists (by default) don't possess positive beliefs about god claims, but reject these claims. Atheists might believe other things in a positive sense, but not with respect to god claims.

Nicely done TBD.

A little story...

Until yesterday I didn’t know I didn’t believe in Zot, Creator of the Creator of the Multiverse. I now have to call myself an a-Zotheist because most of the people around me are Zotheists and this is how I distinguish my non-belief from their belief.

Mind you no evidence has been given for Zot’s existence by the Zotheists but they are an overbearing, intrusive, bunch of zealots that want me to live my life based on the life and teachings of Zot as ridiculous as they might be.

So go ahead and call me an a-Zotheist, I believe such a being does not exist and cannot exist. However, since I am a pragmatist, I concede that if empirical evidence of Zot were to come to light I would acknowledge such.

Until then I remain completely unconvinced of Zotheist’s imaginings.

Living my life as though there was any possibility of Zot existing is completely ridiculous.

Put me down for a 7.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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19-08-2015, 06:30 PM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
I've never cared for this scale, because while I can say I don't "know" god(s) exist(s), -- and that does mean I acknowledge the remote possibility that one or more might -- I'm still certain that no religion I've read about has provided a cogent definition of god(s) amenable to human conception.

I don't know, but I goddamned well don't believe, so in terms of knowledge, I'm a six, and in terms of belief, I'm a seven.
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19-08-2015, 06:34 PM (This post was last modified: 20-08-2015 02:05 PM by Full Circle.)
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 12:00 AM)pablo Wrote:  (6000th post)

Braggart Angry

Thumbsup

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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20-08-2015, 12:44 AM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(19-08-2015 12:21 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(19-08-2015 10:48 AM)Chas Wrote:  Your examples and arguments aren't even close to the dragon-in-the-garage that Sagan argues.
You are focused too much on the analogy and have lost sight of the points that Carl was making.
There is no reason to limit Carl's point to dealing with claims of magical things.
His point applies to much more than that

I am not the one misinterpreting his point. He is not talking about magical things - he is talking about undetectable things.

That you so misunderstand a clearly written section from one of the best popular science authors is just amazing. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-08-2015, 12:46 AM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
(20-08-2015 12:44 AM)Chas Wrote:  I am not the one misinterpreting his point. He is not talking about magical things - he is talking about undetectable things.

That you so misunderstand a clearly written section from one of the best popular science authors is just amazing. Drinking Beverage

*cough*

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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20-08-2015, 04:23 AM
RE: The Dawkins Scale
I stepped on the Dawkins scale and it told me
"One at a time please"

(22-08-2015 07:30 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It is by will alone I set my brows in motion it is by the conditioner of avocado that the brows acquire volume the skin acquires spots the spots become a warning. It is by will alone I set my brows in motion.
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