The European Union UK Referendum
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22-06-2016, 09:41 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 09:16 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Is the monarchy value for money? Let's privatise and tax it to find out. After first taking back all the assets it stole though. And serve? You mean by having undue influence on the political process and being protected from journalistic scrutiny by the law you mean? Personally I prefer democratically officials to serve me.
The Queen does pay tax now and she advises her influence is minimal and our democratically elected leaders are under no obligation to do anything she may or may not say and she has no vote either.
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22-06-2016, 10:02 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 09:41 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 09:16 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Is the monarchy value for money? Let's privatise and tax it to find out. After first taking back all the assets it stole though. And serve? You mean by having undue influence on the political process and being protected from journalistic scrutiny by the law you mean? Personally I prefer democratically officials to serve me.
The Queen does pay tax now and she advises her influence is minimal and our democratically elected leaders are under no obligation to do anything she may or may not say and she has no vote either.

You do however still have a House of Lords.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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22-06-2016, 10:06 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 10:02 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 09:41 AM)adey67 Wrote:  The Queen does pay tax now and she advises her influence is minimal and our democratically elected leaders are under no obligation to do anything she may or may not say and she has no vote either.

You do however still have a House of Lords.

Only a relatively small proportion of the Lords are hereditary peers most are life peers for services rendered and encompass the political spectrum.
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22-06-2016, 10:08 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
Revenant77x ' Wrote:  You do however still have a House of Lords.

True dat, though that will hopefully be a referendum for another day

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22-06-2016, 10:08 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 10:06 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:02 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  You do however still have a House of Lords.

Only a relatively small proportion of the Lords are hereditary peers most are life peers for services rendered and encompass the political spectrum.

Church of England has several seats in your government making the UK technically a Theocracy.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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22-06-2016, 10:14 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 10:08 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:06 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Only a relatively small proportion of the Lords are hereditary peers most are life peers for services rendered and encompass the political spectrum.

Church of England has several seats in your government making the UK technically a Theocracy.

Agreed and I do not believe any clergy should have a seat in the Lords. But they are a minority and the emphasis should definitely be on the word technically as compared to the USA the number of secular politicians or politicians who do not use religion as a political tool is huge.
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22-06-2016, 10:22 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 10:14 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:08 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Church of England has several seats in your government making the UK technically a Theocracy.

Agreed and I do not believe any clergy should have a seat in the Lords. But they are a minority and the emphasis should definitely be on the word technically as compared to the USA the number of secular politicians or politicians who do not use religion as a political tool is huge.

No doubt there but my point was the Queen was not the only unelected hereditary position in the government of the UK, and she might be a mere figurehead but the House of Lords does have a real effect on the laws and policies in the UK.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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22-06-2016, 10:45 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
Still rotating the same, soverngty and tradition are values to uphold.. because. I guess because they've existed before as ways. Still can't quite get over how that's often just assumed on its own sake of merrit

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22-06-2016, 11:04 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 10:22 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:14 AM)adey67 Wrote:  Agreed and I do not believe any clergy should have a seat in the Lords. But they are a minority and the emphasis should definitely be on the word technically as compared to the USA the number of secular politicians or politicians who do not use religion as a political tool is huge.

No doubt there but my point was the Queen was not the only unelected hereditary position in the government of the UK, and she might be a mere figurehead but the House of Lords does have a real effect on the laws and policies in the UK.
Point taken but my point is that even taking these heredity peers into account the vast majority are political life peers encompassing a broad spectrum of political views its not perfect but neither is the U.S.congress or senate some of those positions are family dynasties where election is a forgone conclusion pretty much.
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22-06-2016, 11:18 AM
RE: The European Union UK Referendum
(22-06-2016 11:04 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(22-06-2016 10:22 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  No doubt there but my point was the Queen was not the only unelected hereditary position in the government of the UK, and she might be a mere figurehead but the House of Lords does have a real effect on the laws and policies in the UK.
Point taken but my point is that even taking these heredity peers into account the vast majority are political life peers encompassing a broad spectrum of political views its not perfect but neither is the U.S.congress or senate some of those positions are family dynasties where election is a forgone conclusion pretty much.

Actually not so much, very few seats are 100% on lockdown and even those tend to move on once the holder dies/retires rather than pass down to their kid. Strom Thurmond held a senate seat from roughly 5 minutes before the big bang to 2003 yet his seat went to Lindsey Graham not one of his children. The Kennedy's are a political dynasty but they tend to be spread out rather than lock down 1 position over generations. Our problem is the Parties tend to hold onto seats due to Redistricting and Gerrymandering rather than a single family holds it.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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