The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
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15-04-2015, 09:42 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
I didn't realize their blind faith was hidden. It always seemed apparent to me.
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15-04-2015, 10:04 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
Quote:I’m not denying that they are indeed intelligent people and I don’t want to say anything derogatory about them.


Just because people are intelligent does not mean they are not delusional. In WLC's case he is just a con artist bleeding idiots for money. Religion has always been a lucrative scam.

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15-04-2015, 11:45 PM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(15-04-2015 10:04 AM)Minimalist Wrote:  
Quote:I’m not denying that they are indeed intelligent people and I don’t want to say anything derogatory about them.


Just because people are intelligent does not mean they are not delusional. In WLC's case he is just a con artist bleeding idiots for money. Religion has always been a lucrative scam.

Any basis for this claim? Even Krauss thought he was a con artist, but changed his mind and apologized publicly.
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16-04-2015, 12:09 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
He does sorta come across quite slimy, from the little I've watched of him. I wouldn't waste my time writing books and being generally boring though, if I didn't actually believe what I was writing...

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16-04-2015, 04:20 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(15-04-2015 11:45 PM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  
(15-04-2015 10:04 AM)Minimalist Wrote:  Just because people are intelligent does not mean they are not delusional. In WLC's case he is just a con artist bleeding idiots for money. Religion has always been a lucrative scam.

Any basis for this claim? Even Krauss thought he was a con artist, but changed his mind and apologized publicly.

Um, no he didn't. He publicly apologized for dissing philosophy.

In other news:




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16-04-2015, 05:01 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(16-04-2015 04:20 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(15-04-2015 11:45 PM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  Any basis for this claim? Even Krauss thought he was a con artist, but changed his mind and apologized publicly.

Um, no he didn't. He publicly apologized for dissing philosophy.

In other news:




I really wanted to find the video of Krauss admitting he thought WLC was a charlatan but changed his mind and actually apologized in one of the Australia debates, but they are 2 hour long videos... If you have time, yes, it's definitely there. If you still don't believe me I might search for it some more...
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16-04-2015, 05:26 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(16-04-2015 05:01 AM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  I really wanted to find the video of Krauss admitting he thought WLC was a charlatan but changed his mind and actually apologized in one of the Australia debates, but they are 2 hour long videos... If you have time, yes, it's definitely there. If you still don't believe me I might search for it some more...

You could always link to the video and either include the H : M : S part you want in the URL, or you could just tell people what part to watch when you post the link.
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16-04-2015, 09:47 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(16-04-2015 05:26 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(16-04-2015 05:01 AM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  I really wanted to find the video of Krauss admitting he thought WLC was a charlatan but changed his mind and actually apologized in one of the Australia debates, but they are 2 hour long videos... If you have time, yes, it's definitely there. If you still don't believe me I might search for it some more...

You could always link to the video and either include the H : M : S part you want in the URL, or you could just tell people what part to watch when you post the link.

I just know it's in there, I don't remember where anymore.
I did find a reference here on Craig's site to it. Apparently it's in the third debate.
http://www.reasonablefaith.org/the-first...-australia

Dr. Craig: Yes, that’s right. And you notice, Kevin, for those who will listen to all three dialogues, in the final dialogue in Melbourne he says this: “I came here thinking that Dr. Craig was a charlatan,” and he said, “I no longer believe that. I now think that he believes deeply what he says.”[5] So now he thinks that I’m just sincerely deluded but not a charlatan. And after the final dialogue in Melbourne, as we shook hands, he said to me privately, he said, “Bill” – we were on a first name basis by then – he said, “Bill, I have a note of faint praise that I want to convey to you. I realize it’s faint, but I do want to convey it to you.” And he said, “I now no longer think that you’re lying about the things that you say. I really do believe that you sincerely hold to the arguments that you offer.” And I said, “Well, thank you very much for at least that faint note of praise.” So his attitude did change to a degree. I still find it incredibly condescending to say that I’m a fool rather than a charlatan, but I guess I’d rather be thought a fool, Kevin, than a charlatan. I don’t mind people thinking I’m stupid but I am troubled when they attack my character, and say that I’m an immoral man.
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16-04-2015, 10:10 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(16-04-2015 09:47 AM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  
(16-04-2015 05:26 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  You could always link to the video and either include the H : M : S part you want in the URL, or you could just tell people what part to watch when you post the link.

I just know it's in there, I don't remember where anymore.
I did find a reference here on Craig's site to it. Apparently it's in the third debate.
http://www.reasonablefaith.org/the-first...-australia

Dr. Craig: Yes, that’s right. And you notice, Kevin, for those who will listen to all three dialogues, in the final dialogue in Melbourne he says this: “I came here thinking that Dr. Craig was a charlatan,” and he said, “I no longer believe that. I now think that he believes deeply what he says.”[5] So now he thinks that I’m just sincerely deluded but not a charlatan. And after the final dialogue in Melbourne, as we shook hands, he said to me privately, he said, “Bill” – we were on a first name basis by then – he said, “Bill, I have a note of faint praise that I want to convey to you. I realize it’s faint, but I do want to convey it to you.” And he said, “I now no longer think that you’re lying about the things that you say. I really do believe that you sincerely hold to the arguments that you offer.” And I said, “Well, thank you very much for at least that faint note of praise.” So his attitude did change to a degree. I still find it incredibly condescending to say that I’m a fool rather than a charlatan, but I guess I’d rather be thought a fool, Kevin, than a charlatan. I don’t mind people thinking I’m stupid but I am troubled when they attack my character, and say that I’m an immoral man.

I remember the debate somewhere as well, but I find the last portion funny.

Quote: I still find it incredibly condescending to say that I’m a fool rather than a charlatan, but I guess I’d rather be thought a fool, Kevin, than a charlatan. I don’t mind people thinking I’m stupid but I am troubled when they attack my character, and say that I’m an immoral man.

Really? Because that's what most xtians think about atheists. Hell, even their book calls non-believers fools.
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16-04-2015, 10:17 AM
RE: The Hidden Blind Faith of Christian Intellectuals that Makes Debates Pointless
(16-04-2015 09:47 AM)emeraldcrown Wrote:  Dr. Craig: Yes, that’s right. And you notice, Kevin, for those who will listen to all three dialogues, in the final dialogue in Melbourne he says this: “I came here thinking that Dr. Craig was a charlatan,” and he said, “I no longer believe that. I now think that he believes deeply what he says.”[5] So now he thinks that I’m just sincerely deluded but not a charlatan. And after the final dialogue in Melbourne, as we shook hands, he said to me privately, he said, “Bill” – we were on a first name basis by then – he said, “Bill, I have a note of faint praise that I want to convey to you. I realize it’s faint, but I do want to convey it to you.” And he said, “I now no longer think that you’re lying about the things that you say. I really do believe that you sincerely hold to the arguments that you offer.” And I said, “Well, thank you very much for at least that faint note of praise.” So his attitude did change to a degree. I still find it incredibly condescending to say that I’m a fool rather than a charlatan, but I guess I’d rather be thought a fool, Kevin, than a charlatan. I don’t mind people thinking I’m stupid but I am troubled when they attack my character, and say that I’m an immoral man.

I think I'd actually have more respect for Craig as a charlatan; it'd take a lot of intelligence and bravado to keep up the pretense as well as he does. He'd be acting completely immorally, but he'd deserve some credit for doing such an excellent job of it. The idea that he actually believes the bullshit that he says is just sad.

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