The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
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10-09-2014, 11:17 AM (This post was last modified: 10-09-2014 04:32 PM by WindyCityJazz.)
The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
"You don't believe in God?! Well, that's scary!"

Most, if not all of us, have heard this one before when telling somebody that we are atheist. The thing I find funny about this is, considering their arguments, shouldn't WE be afraid of THEM?

They claim that there is no morality without God. Therefore, they are scared of us because, according to them, without a belief in God we have no reason to be moral. Call me crazy, but I find the notion that their belief in an invisible man in the sky is the only thing keeping them from going on a killing spree to be quite scary. Seriously, when people make this argument to me, this is what it sounds like:

"Hello! My name is Jimmy McJibbers, and I believe in an invisible man in the sky! It's the only thing that is keeping me from going on a rampage where I kill every person in my path!"

Yet, they can't understand why I feel like I'm the one that should be slowly backing away and saying "Uhh...yeah...it was nice talking to you..."

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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10-09-2014, 11:25 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
Yes, you're right of course. But I can't help but think that most of the ones who are moral now would continue to be moral if they suddenly discovered their god is myth. They just don't recognize it much like they don't recognize the fallacies in their thinking.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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10-09-2014, 11:30 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
(10-09-2014 11:25 AM)Impulse Wrote:  Yes, you're right of course. But I can't help but think that most of the ones who are moral now would continue to be moral if they suddenly discovered their god is myth. They just don't recognize it much like they don't recognize the fallacies in their thinking.

Of course they would still be moral. I think most of us here were former believers ourselves, so that in itself is proof that their claim is ridiculous. I just find it humorous the way it comes across. Smile

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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10-09-2014, 11:35 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
I'd like to know why they'd even fear us to begin with.

What, their big magical sky daddy can't protect them from a few atheists?

Popcorn I put more thought into fiction than theists put into reality.
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10-09-2014, 11:36 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
Even though we know they would probably continue to be moral if they figured out god didnt exist, its still worth pointing out if it comes up.

"So you only do the right thing/You would murder and kill and rape/You would be bad if it werent for god? THAT is scary."
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10-09-2014, 11:38 AM (This post was last modified: 10-09-2014 12:10 PM by Aseptic Skeptic.)
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
That's irrational on two fronts.

First, as we all know, our morality, such as it is, is an evolutionary advantage. Deluded or not, those theists have the same evolutionary advantage. If they lose their theism, their morality will still be the same - they'll just have to attribute it to something other than a sky daddy. Sure, some may be psychopaths, but there is no evidence to suggest that theists are more or less likely to suffer from psychopathy than anyone else, so no reason to fear them more than anyone else.

Second, you're doing to them what they do to you. The same exact level of ignorance. They assume that you don't have real morality because you don't believe in their god. You assume they don't have real morality because they believe they get it from a source you know to be imaginary. You know they're wrong about you, so why do you make the same mistake about them?

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10-09-2014, 11:39 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
It's the standard theist thing of giving praise to God for their own actions...


"Name me a moral statement made or moral action performed that could not have been made or done, by a non-believer..." - Christopher Hitchens



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10-09-2014, 11:39 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
(10-09-2014 11:30 AM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  Of course they would still be moral. I think most of us here were former believers ourselves, so that in itself is proof that their claim is ridiculous. I just find it humorous the way it comes across. Smile
Yeah good point. And they might even become more moral because some things get re-evaluated like homosexuality, for example.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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10-09-2014, 11:40 AM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
(10-09-2014 11:36 AM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Even though we know they would probably continue to be moral if they figured out god didnt exist, its still worth pointing out if it comes up.

"So you only do the right thing/You would murder and kill and rape/You would be bad if it werent for god? THAT is scary."

I agree, this can be a useful straw man to illuminate the theist's own misconception, but as the little lady says, we know theists would still be moral without god (well, at least to the same extent that everyone else is; there are always outliers).

"Whores perform the same function as priests, but far more thoroughly." - Robert A. Heinlein
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10-09-2014, 12:08 PM
RE: The "No morals without God" Claim...Shouldn't The Atheists Be Fearing The Theists?
Christians have it in their mind that all evil deeds are the result of the devil. This is because they do not want to take accountability for their own actions and responsibility for admitting that people, including them, can do, and do bad things.

Now, the next logical step is to set that fear into the hearts of people and make the claim that morality and knowledge itself is only possible through their religion and their sect and denomination of their religion alone. Once you are able to convince a fool of this, than they are yours forever and so is their money and since you have more numbers of people than the other religions, your religion must be the true one.

It's simple logic. That is why they believe it. It is because a long time ago, the fool was lied to.


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