The Question
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
28-10-2012, 09:24 PM
The Question
I'm not sure if I can relate to most of the material here. Growing up God wasn't much a part of our thinking. Looking back on it now I can equate it with luck, more than anything. We say things like "Good luck," or "He has the worst luck" but what do those things mean. We say things like "God, your so slow," and "Goddammit," but what do those things mean to us? Not much of anything. We certainly weren't church goers but I can't recall us labeling ourselves atheist, either.

I think I began to see myself as, in some sense, atheist, only when in the military it seemed such a stark contrast to my thinking. There seems to be a lot of Christians who want to go to war with other people. As I began to see the dishonesty and futility of that it seemed to sharpen the contrast between atheist and theist.

To me it seems that a big part of atheism is theism, inasmuch as in order to be properly against something it is the responsibility of the person to inform himself about it as much as possible. You should know yourself and your enemy.

I would appreciate any help in learning about theism as much as any help with atheist learning about atheism.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Mini Gun Fodder's post
28-10-2012, 09:27 PM
RE: The Question
(28-10-2012 09:24 PM)Mini Gun Fodder Wrote:  I'm not sure if I can relate to most of the material here. Growing up God wasn't much a part of our thinking. Looking back on it now I can equate it with luck, more than anything. We say things like "Good luck," or "He has the worst luck" but what do those things mean. We say things like "God, your so slow," and "Goddammit," but what do those things mean to us? Not much of anything. We certainly weren't church goers but I can't recall us labeling ourselves atheist, either.

I think I began to see myself as, in some sense, atheist, only when in the military it seemed such a stark contrast to my thinking. There seems to be a lot of Christians who want to go to war with other people. As I began to see the dishonesty and futility of that it seemed to sharpen the contrast between atheist and theist.

To me it seems that a big part of atheism is theism, inasmuch as in order to be properly against something it is the responsibility of the person to inform himself about it as much as possible. You should know yourself and your enemy.

I would appreciate any help in learning about theism as much as any help with atheist learning about atheism.

I usually say those phrases as figure of speeches. I don't really believe in God, but due to the social environment, I grew up with a certain Ideas on god, and thus those phrases were instilled into me.

[Image: 0013382F-E507-48AE-906B-53008666631C-757...cc3639.jpg]
Credit goes to UndercoverAtheist.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Atothetheist's post
28-10-2012, 09:51 PM
RE: The Question
What's that, you wanna learn about cats, so you come to the dog pound? Big Grin

[Image: klingon_zps7e68578a.jpg]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes houseofcantor's post
28-10-2012, 09:51 PM
RE: The Question
It's more like 86% of the people believe that the earth is flat in spite of all the evidence to the contrary.

We are not aflatearthists, the damn thing is just round, that's all.

Hope this helps.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-10-2012, 10:39 PM
RE: The Question
(28-10-2012 09:27 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  I usually say those phrases as figure of speeches. I don't really believe in God, but due to the social environment, I grew up with a certain Ideas on god, and thus those phrases were instilled into me.

That's what I meant, except for possibly I grew up with no ideas on god.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-10-2012, 10:41 PM
RE: The Question
(28-10-2012 09:51 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  What's that, you wanna learn about cats, so you come to the dog pound? Big Grin

Not exactly. I'm a cat who wants to learn about dogs from cats with experience with dogs, I guess.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Mini Gun Fodder's post
28-10-2012, 10:42 PM
RE: The Question
(28-10-2012 09:51 PM)Thomas Wrote:  It's more like 86% of the people believe that the earth is flat in spite of all the evidence to the contrary.

We are not aflatearthists, the damn thing is just round, that's all.

Hope this helps.

I have to admit, I have no idea what you are talking about. Confused
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-10-2012, 11:43 PM
RE: The Question
For the record, not all of us have it out for religion. I, for one, do not give a shit what people want to believe, so long as it doesn't affect me. Once it affects me, then I will likely have something to say. I think the world would be a better place without religion, but I'm not on a mission to de-convert people. If others are on a mission to convert me, they will likely leave with a bruised ego though.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-10-2012, 11:52 PM
RE: The Question
(28-10-2012 10:41 PM)Mini Gun Fodder Wrote:  
(28-10-2012 09:51 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  What's that, you wanna learn about cats, so you come to the dog pound? Big Grin

Not exactly. I'm a cat who wants to learn about dogs from cats with experience with dogs, I guess.

Well then, you came to the right place. I also don't have it out for anyone. I find it all fascinating. Pretty stupid, but fascinating. There are those here who know more about religion than the religionists.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2012, 12:33 AM
RE: The Question
Okay, Mini. First of all, you're someone struggling to even figure out what the concepts of religion ARE. Not someone who knows what they are and rejects them or is uncertain about them. The word for you is an ignostic or an igtheist. (Cue the low grade flame war; I'm an out ignostic and a lot of people here think the distinction with atheism is meaningless or silly. Others may complain I'm poaching.) If you're saying "I don't really understand what this theism thing is but I'm pretty sure it's bull WITHOUT understanding what it is," then you're both an ignostic and an atheist.

Now the first thing you need to realize about the theistic perspective is that there's no such thing as THE theistic perspective. There's hundreds or thousands or myriads of different theistic perspectives, and NONE OF THEM AGREE. None. (If they did, they wouldn't be different perspectives.) This is most telling between different religions (or different denominations/sects/schools within the same religion), but still very much present even inside all these categories. For this reason, always argue with GROUPS of theists, find the points of dissension, and turn them against each other. Never take them on solo. That's nowhere near as fun.

Also, and more importantly, realize that what one person says or believes or envisions about the identity or nature of, say, God, or the soul, or salvation, or any of the buzzwords, is probably not the same thing as what the next person says or believes or envisions. This stops getting confusing when you realize that different people are using the same words to refer to different concepts and NEVER REALIZING IT. So when one person tells you that God is all-loving, and another tells you that the same God's an angry, wrathful Lord looking to damn you to eternal torture for the slightest sin, it's not that God is paradoxically both at once. It's that they're talking about different gods and haven't figured it out yet.

Bottom line, remember that it's the job of a theist (at least, one trying to persuade you) to clearly articulate WHAT they're trying to persuade you of. (Also, the task of persuasion is theirs as well, assuming they're trying to persuade you at all. Don't let them con you into thinking you've got to either disprove their beliefs or admit that they're proven.) If they're pushing some alien god concept on you that you just don't understand, it's they're job to explain it in terms you can understand, before they can even begin trying to convince you of it. If you're feeling helpful, you can explain what parts of their particular description or conception you're having trouble understanding, but that's charity on your part. If you're REALLY feeling charitable, identify the inconsistencies inherent in most conceptions of God as things that you're not understanding, and ask them to please help you figure out what you're missing there.

I now turn you over to the welcoming, merciful, and above all extremely helpful and charitable hands of my fellow boardizens, so that they may start listing some of the most common conceptions of things like God, heaven, hell, souls, etc, and the variations there-on.

"If I ignore the alternatives, the only option is God; I ignore them; therefore God." -- The Syllogism of Fail
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Reltzik's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: