The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
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23-05-2013, 11:25 AM
The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
The revolutionary war was over slavery, the pro-slavery side won the first one.

Simon Schama
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmcgwD8VRmI

Slavery was at that time the main source of income, the british knew this so they employed a form of economic warfare. The British freed many slaves and many slaves agreed to fight for the British. Now of course the British were only doing this to try to win a war but this is not usually told in history books.
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23-05-2013, 12:15 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
If that only happened after the war started, then it can't be what the war was about.

Slavery was only abolished in British North America a generation later. Two generations later for the Empire as a whole.
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23-05-2013, 12:26 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 12:15 PM)cjlr Wrote:  If that only happened after the war started, then it can't be what the war was about.

Slavery was only abolished in British North America a generation later. Two generations later for the Empire as a whole.

What did you think about the video I posted of that author of the book explaining the book? Drinking Beverage

The policy of allowing freedom to slaves that sided with England happened throughout the whole revolutionary war.

Semantics is fun Rolleyes "about"
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23-05-2013, 12:58 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 12:26 PM)I and I Wrote:  What did you think about the video I posted of that author of the book explaining the book? Drinking Beverage

The policy of allowing freedom to slaves that sided with England happened throughout the whole revolutionary war.

Semantics is fun Rolleyes "about"

I haven't had time to watch the whole video yet.

That part of the war is taught in Canada (a lot of freed slaves settled in Canada afterwards, since they couldn't well stay in the USA; there was a whole district outside Halifax of black freedmen (freedpeople?)). Though, some loyalists also brought slaves with them, though since many more slaves were in the US south (where it's much harder to get to Canada) that wasn't really that many. Many more were dumped back in Africa (Sierra Leone).

It's just that saying it was 'about' slavery seems to imply it was about slavery the same way the US civil war was (ie whether or not there should be slavery). Not, as it was, a matter of the British simply being opportunistic.
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23-05-2013, 01:36 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
I and I you take the point that many slaves supported the British in the revolutionary war because the British freed them and conflate that to mean the whole war was about slavery. Not a necessary conclusion.

You would make a much better argument that the civil war was not about slavery and that Lincoln freed the slaves out of political motives and not because of actual conviction (as the book you linked to elsewhere apparently argues).

Anyone who pays attention knows that the revolutionary war was about a lot of things with slavery not at all a significant aspect. The "founding fathers" for the most part were slave owners and did not free their slaves to any significant degree. I am not sure they cared much one way or another that the British for political reasons were freeing slaves.
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23-05-2013, 02:23 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 01:36 PM)JAH Wrote:  I and I you take the point that many slaves supported the British in the revolutionary war because the British freed them and conflate that to mean the whole war was about slavery. Not a necessary conclusion.

You would make a much better argument that the civil war was not about slavery and that Lincoln freed the slaves out of political motives and not because of actual conviction (as the book you linked to elsewhere apparently argues).

Anyone who pays attention knows that the revolutionary war was about a lot of things with slavery not at all a significant aspect. The "founding fathers" for the most part were slave owners and did not free their slaves to any significant degree. I am not sure they cared much one way or another that the British for political reasons were freeing slaves.

Some of the founding fathers slaves escaped during this time and made it to freedom. It's not a good story to tell the kids that while the founding fathers were talking about freedom (supposedly), their slaves were escaping and some joining the british fight.

I say supposedly they were talking about freedom because I think that could be historical revisionism. I don't think the founding fathers of the U.S. had any intention on creating a radically different form of government, they wanted independence and that was it.

What a war is about is like arguing about what a painting means.
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23-05-2013, 03:09 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 02:23 PM)I and I Wrote:  What a war is about is like arguing about what a painting means.

But wars are declared and fought for a reason. I think that's a pretty good way to find out what they're "about", no?
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23-05-2013, 09:28 PM
The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 03:09 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(23-05-2013 02:23 PM)I and I Wrote:  What a war is about is like arguing about what a painting means.

But wars are declared and fought for a reason. I think that's a pretty good way to find out what they're "about", no?

Economic independence comes with political independence. One needs both to be truly independent, so as a form of economic warfare the freeing of slaves was a big issue during war. The guy goes In detail of writings by revolutionary leaders about this issue, and stopping this freeing of slaves was key to winning a war. When the British controlled New York they met with military commanders of the revolutionary army and discussed this very issue.
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23-05-2013, 09:51 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
Banana_zorro

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23-05-2013, 10:08 PM
RE: The Revolutionary War: The first war over slavery.
(23-05-2013 09:28 PM)I and I Wrote:  Economic independence comes with political independence. One needs both to be truly independent, so as a form of economic warfare the freeing of slaves was a big issue during war. The guy goes In detail of writings by revolutionary leaders about this issue, and stopping this freeing of slaves was key to winning a war. When the British controlled New York they met with military commanders of the revolutionary army and discussed this very issue.

I watched the video. It was interesting to know that it's sort of forgotten history in the UK (I'd assumed it would be in the US anyway), but like I said, that element of the war of independence is mentioned as part of our history in Canada. Your OP was overly broad and needlessly provocative.

You said it [the whole war] was about slavery. Shall I remind you?

(23-05-2013 11:25 AM)I and I Wrote:  The revolutionary war was over slavery, the pro-slavery side won the first one.

Which is demonstrably untrue. The British weren't "anti-slavery" in any way. They were pro-"screwing with our opponents". If the American rebels had been defeated there would still have been slavery.

Since it was not a cause of the war, and not a goal of the war, and not an outcome of the war, it's unreasonable to say the war was about slavery. I would hardly have thought that conclusion controversial...
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