The Rise of Islam- Why Islam is a Revolting Religion
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23-10-2015, 09:56 AM (This post was last modified: 23-10-2015 10:01 AM by Deltabravo.)
RE: The Rise of Islam- Why Islam is a Revolting Religion
(22-10-2015 10:48 PM)DLJ Wrote:  DB, I gave your post a 'like' because I enjoy seeing someone have a good rant. TTA is a great enabler for that.

Do you feel better for it? I hope so.

The problem you are identifying is one, as ever, of when an ideology becomes politicised.

There are many officially Islamic countries, of course, where this ideology is held at bay by necessities such as trade ... from whence comes generally good stuff like cultural diversity, awareness and knowledge.

It's these things that lead to good governance. Good governance is secular ... by definition.

All is not lost.

Wink


Thanks, it's nice to have a like rather than a kick in the nuts.

I feel the need to get this crap out of my system. The Korotaev paper is very good and worth a read, unlike almost everything else about religion which is based on reading the "Book" of the religion.

I posted some stuff about the Welsh being the real "Jews". It is nonsense but it has a point to it. Here are "People" with a national story and it doesn't tie in with the Holy Lands. Neither does their DNA. You can find whole populations of people who don't give a flying turd about Judaism or Islam or anything to do with the Middle East and don't preoccupy themselves with the issue any more than they would think about Outer Mongolian history and politics. In fact, they are quite happy and would prefer to have no connection at all with the Near and Middle East, Judaism, Abrahamism etc etc.

Why is it that there is so much focus on "Peoples" who want to find their "roots" in Jerusalem? All it results in is strife and wars.

The Korotaev article just explodes all that for Islam.

The stuff I posted about Homer is also part of the same picture. The "guild" of Homeriads just disappear in history... But then a similar literary movement appears in Alexandria, writing in Greek. And out comes the Old Testament.

What is it about? Homer was a collection of tales about the Greeks and their Gods. Judaism is a collection of tales about some people who were descended from Abram or Abraham of Ur of the Chaldees, in Sumeria or southern Iraq. He was a Keltoi or Celt. Celt just means someone who belongs to a community which is formed around a "cell" or a church. The Chaldeans are now Christians.

It's all bullshit. One could say that the whole of Judea, the Near East, Egypt, North Africa, Turkey was inhabited by Celts. What of it? All the names in Judea are references to Gauls/Celts (same word, different spelling) Names like Galillee, Golan all refer back to these people and you find traces in modern Celtic names like the Hebrides, Hibernia, etc etc.

So, why does one "People", who aren't even in the slightest interested in tracing their ancestry back to this "hell hole" of the Near East, 1) not give a shit about their ancestry anyway and 2) give rise to howls of laughter if one were to suggest that the name for Wales outside Wales is "the Land of the Gauls".

I think the same attitude to this should be applied to Judaism in equal measure. I think people should laugh out loud when they hear statement like "Jerusalem is the eternal home of the Jewish People". Taking the Old Testament and trying to make it the basis for creating a "People" is as stupid as taking Homer and using it to create a nation. It's the same type of writing created by the same type of writing "guild" and it should be treated in the same way as every other national myth.

I've come to admire, actually, the New Testament, because I now see it for what it is, thanks to both Joe Atwill and Ralph Ellis. I don't agree with either but they are big callers out of "bull shit" and I like that. You have to read the New Testament in the context of its time and what was going on, but again, people continue to get stuck on the timing of it so they go down the path of saying it is either a Buddhist nobody or a fiction...that's it.

I think that with most people being unable to reason their way out of a paper bag and unable to put aside the irrelevant frippery we see on here, it is difficult to see how mankind is going to deal with "religiosity" which is being given a big boost by "political correctness"...we dare not offend any religious group...even if they mutilate babies, believe in beheading etc etc.

You get my point. For me, Christianity is marvellous take down of Abrahamic religion, if you read it the way Atwill suggests. Here we have a man born into a nonsense religion with women talking nonsense about having a baby by the "Holy Spirit". It just goes on reciting more and more ridiculousness. I utterly believe that whoever wrote it was a rationalist and was doing this knowing full well it was ridiculous BUT, equally, that it would hook the gullible, utterly and completely, with their own bullshit. He then stuck in "do unto others", followed by a list of examples which completely turns Abrahamic religion on its head and even reinvented the nature of the "god" as merely "logos". This, for the simple religious mind is too much so the simpleton accepts they must behave according to the edicts of the religion but the complete transformation of "god the big man" into a concept of "reason" is utterly missed. What a wheeze, what a fantastic view of it. That is why I find Atwill so incredibly fascinating and such a breath of fresh air and realism.

But, only the intelligent actually understand that you can't have a moral system based on "an eye for an eye" and goat sacrifice. So, Korotaev explains that. The existing "feudal" society which existed in the Near and Middle East fell apart and up rises this horrific Abrahamic religion again, which is really the "Judaism" which prevailed at the time of Jesus, except with a new mumbo jumbo of a "book" and a new "prophet".

And then, almost on the periphery, some of the people who repopulated Europe after the "exodus" from the fried Middle East adopt Homeric tales to justify dragging the rest of us back into this Middle Eastern, never ending show of bombing and beheading in the name of this assholular Abrahamism. As though we give a shit.
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23-10-2015, 11:30 AM
RE: The Rise of Islam- Why Islam is a Revolting Religion
(23-10-2015 09:56 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  ...
Thanks, it's nice to have a like rather than a kick in the nuts.
...

No problem. I like the way you write. Or the more traditional quip ... why not both? Big Grin

(23-10-2015 09:56 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  ...
I posted some stuff about the Welsh being the real "Jews".
...

Just out of interest, did you know that my father is Welsh and my mother is an Austrian Jew?

Does this make me a potential heir to the throne of Westeros or something?

Wink

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23-10-2015, 01:51 PM
RE: The Rise of Islam- Why Islam is a Revolting Religion
(23-10-2015 11:30 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(23-10-2015 09:56 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  ...
Thanks, it's nice to have a like rather than a kick in the nuts.
...

No problem. I like the way you write. Or the more traditional quip ... why not both? Big Grin

(23-10-2015 09:56 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  ...
I posted some stuff about the Welsh being the real "Jews".
...

Just out of interest, did you know that my father is Welsh and my mother is an Austrian Jew?

No.Thumbsup

Does this make me a potential heir to the throne of Westeros or something?

Probably.Bowing
Wink

I lived with my Welsh grandmother as a child so I have a particular affinity towards the people. It has not been a great disappointment to me to find that they are not the "chosen people".

On my father's side I am descended from a long line of illiterate Devon farmers, no doubt stretching back to before the Norman conquest. Apparently that makes me genetically Brithonic/Celt and closely related to the Basques, all of whom seem to have no relation to religious events in the Near East, for which I am extremely grateful. I can also be assured that no one in my ancestry who I can ever trace has ever been anyone of any significance.

This is probably why I don't have any particular interest in cultural theories about people wanting to use some fairy tales in books to trace their lineage back to some middle eastern dump so as to big themselves up.
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