The Theist Dilemma
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13-02-2014, 05:56 PM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 05:03 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(13-02-2014 04:48 PM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  You just totally evaded the question.
No, I didn't.
Quote:You disagree, but why?
I explained why. If you don't accept determinism, then actions do not necessarily imply needs, but rather can be the result of desires. E.g. that I eat a bowl of strawberry ice cream does not indicate that I needed to eat strawberry ice cream. I could have simply desired to eat strawberry ice cream. That god frequently chooses to communicate through prophets does not indicate that he needs to communicate through prophets, and indeed the Bible shows him communicating in other ways as well.

If you subscribe to determinism, then I suppose you could say that an action does necessarily imply a need, but then there's no need to ask why there's a need, as the determinist position itself supplies the answer.

OK I see what you're saying now.
Though, you have to admit, EVERYTHING he's "used" was by man. Fairly big coincidence?

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13-02-2014, 05:58 PM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 05:56 PM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  OK I see what you're saying now.
Though, you have to admit, EVERYTHING he's "used" was by man.
The burning bush wasn't a man, it was a bush.
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13-02-2014, 06:21 PM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 05:58 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(13-02-2014 05:56 PM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  OK I see what you're saying now.
Though, you have to admit, EVERYTHING he's "used" was by man.
The burning bush wasn't a man, it was a bush.

True, but how do you know it wasn't made up? It was one guy who lost his sheep and happened to run into a cave by himself. There's no way you could know for a fact it even existed.

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13-02-2014, 06:34 PM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 06:21 PM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  
(13-02-2014 05:58 PM)alpha male Wrote:  The burning bush wasn't a man, it was a bush.

True, but how do you know it wasn't made up? It was one guy who lost his sheep and happened to run into a cave by himself. There's no way you could know for a fact it even existed.

I think he was smokin some poppies.


"Life is a daring adventure or it is nothing"--Helen Keller
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15-02-2014, 12:26 AM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 05:58 PM)alpha male Wrote:  
(13-02-2014 05:56 PM)Im_Ryan Wrote:  OK I see what you're saying now.
Though, you have to admit, EVERYTHING he's "used" was by man.
The burning bush wasn't a man, it was a bush.

How do you 'know' that happened? The word of men.

Q.E.D.

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15-02-2014, 12:39 AM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(12-02-2014 09:15 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  A friend of yours lives alone and invites you over to have a serious discussion.
You discover your friend is suicidal and has a revolver on his bedside table with one bullet in it.

You both discuss the gun and you find out that he purchased it at a gun show today, but forgot to buy bullets. When he arrived home, he discovered the gun had a single bullet in it.
That was when he called you.

He says to you "That single bullet seems to be a sign from god that my death is all part of his plan"
He then leaves the room to check on some food cooking in the oven.

While he is gone, do you take the bullet from the gun ?

Whichever choice you make, how did you arrive at the decision you made ?

If you say that you prayed to god to give you the answer, then I'm going to tell you that god replies with "Leave the bullet in the gun".

Again, I'll ask. Do you take the bullet from the gun ?

If you take the bullet from the gun, you discover the next day that a robber had broken into your friends house and killed him.

If you leave the bullet in the gun, you discover the next day that your friend committed suicide by shooting himself with the gun.

How do you decide what is the morally right thing to do ?
Is it morally right to leave a bullet in a gun with a person who is suicidal ?
Is it morally right to remove a bullet from a gun when it could be that person's only means of self defense if there should be a robbery ?

When you convince yourself that any answer to a question is the right answer if it comes from the ultimate source of good, then you have become a puppet who can be convinced to commit crimes and ignore situations where people need help.

Sorry but that's not a dilemma. The contingency of the robbery renders it a non-dilemma. What you have presented is an idiotic, pointless and incoherent thought experiment that has no significance, just like this:

You want to make coffee but you like your coffee with milk but have run out of milk. You start to walk to the corner shop but you get hit and killed by a drunk driver. Is it a good idea to drink milk?

I suspect that you are a moron.
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15-02-2014, 12:45 AM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
(13-02-2014 06:34 PM)Bows and Arrows Wrote:  I think he was smokin some poppies.

Moses never existed. He's a mythical hero, just like Abraham. There is nothing needing explaining, as the Exodus is pure fiction invented as an origin story for the tribal Jews, who had no idea how their society had formed.

Softly, softly, catchee monkey.
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15-02-2014, 06:46 PM
RE: The Theist Dilemma
I'd wonder why a shop is selling guns.
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