The Trump Impeachment Thread
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12-06-2017, 03:39 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(11-06-2017 08:30 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(11-06-2017 08:18 AM)Heath_Tierney Wrote:  What, exactly, does "back on track" look like? Does it look, economically, like Republican-controlled supply-side Kansas?

That's true, and their hopes have been dashed by his continual lies. When even pro-Trump Fox News and the Wall Street Journal (also owned by Rupert Murdoch) call him out as a liar, well, that pretty much says it all.

Fox News calling Trump a liar:




Wall Street Journal calling Trump a liar: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/22/busin....html?_r=0

*edit to add*

Now, scared for their chances in 2018, some prominent Repubs are starting to call for Trump's impeachment: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/...41796.html

Back on track means the opposite direction of Europe. Not economics...I'm thinking more along the lines of immigration. Safety and security. The latest polls I've seen show about half of Americans support Trump's travel ban. I think we know who those 50% are. The same people that are heavily armed and anti-immigration.

Might makes right huh? I've got a gun so you must do what I say. The very *essence* of democracy and human rights Dodgy

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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12-06-2017, 03:43 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(11-06-2017 08:30 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Back on track means the opposite direction of Europe. Not economics...I'm thinking more along the lines of immigration. Safety and security. The latest polls I've seen show about half of Americans support Trump's travel ban. I think we know who those 50% are. The same people that are heavily armed and anti-immigration.


How about this.

If you want to be anti-immigration, effectively refusing shelter to middle eastern people seeking asylum and safety? You fuckers don't get to celebrate Christmas.

Drinking Beverage

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12-06-2017, 05:14 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
Another attempt by Trump to illegally influence the justice system:

Senior US prosecutor Bharara fired 'after refusing Trump call'

From the article:
Quote:A former leading federal prosecutor in New York has revealed he was sacked by Donald Trump after receiving several unusual phone calls from him.

Preet Bharara told ABC News' This Week he felt the calls from Mr Trump had crossed the usual boundary separating the executive branch and independent criminal investigators.

Mr Bharara said he had been fired after refusing to take a third call.

...it appeared Mr Trump had been trying to "cultivate some kind of relationship" after they met in late 2016.

But he said he felt this was "inappropriate" after Mr Trump took office.

"The number of times that President Obama called me in seven and a half years was zero," he said.
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12-06-2017, 09:31 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
For the record, Comey's testimony are perfectly in line with my assessment of the situation. As for impeachment? Based on what we know so far I think a court would have to rule that Trump's statements to Comey were meant to obstruct justice concerning Flynn, and I don't think his testimony is proof enough of that. I'm far from a lawyer though. Personally, I believe Comey, and believed him when the Republicans hated him, and when the Democrats hated him, and think the charge might be legit, but a man's word is not enough to convict. Nor does his testimony necessarily prove a crime if taken as fact, as there is sufficient room for interpretation (which Comey is well aware of based on his phrasing).

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12-06-2017, 09:53 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(12-06-2017 09:31 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  For the record, Comey's testimony are perfectly in line with my assessment of the situation. As for impeachment? Based on what we know so far I think a court would have to rule that Trump's statements to Comey were meant to obstruct justice concerning Flynn, and I don't think his testimony is proof enough of that. I'm far from a lawyer though.

I doubt any court will be involved. Apparently there is some untested Constitutional question as to whether a sitting President can be indicted for criminal offenses.

#sigh
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12-06-2017, 10:19 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(11-06-2017 10:21 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Lindsey Graham had the best response to charges Trump colluded with Russia, "He can't even collude with his own government, what makes you think he could collude with Russia?"
Lol ... where I think Lindsey is mistaken is that Trump knows a particular WAY to collude and that is the sort of quasi-Mafia style he has deployed throughout his business life. According to Trump's biographer, the past and the future mostly don't exist for Trump, he simply never concedes ground, never changes his story whether or not there's any factual basis for it, and despite counter-factual statements or actions he's done in the past.

This is NOT an effective way to "collude" in government at this level and not even in most business contexts. It works (for some given value of "works") in commercial real estate, especially if you're unperturbed by not paying your bills, not keeping your word, filing bankruptcy where necessary, etc.

So paradoxically I think Trump IS capable of colluding with Russia, particularly given that he has had so many Russian business and finance connections in the past. He simply wouldn't see it AS collusion, but as something perfectly organic and expected. And he would expect to get away with it as easily as he always has.

Trump also "colludes" effectively with his own government if it involves posting cronies / toadies to positions of power and playing them off against each other, etc; he just doesn't "collude" in the deniable, finessed way that political elites expect.
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12-06-2017, 10:38 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(12-06-2017 03:43 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(11-06-2017 08:30 AM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Back on track means the opposite direction of Europe. Not economics...I'm thinking more along the lines of immigration. Safety and security. The latest polls I've seen show about half of Americans support Trump's travel ban. I think we know who those 50% are. The same people that are heavily armed and anti-immigration.


How about this.

If you want to be anti-immigration, effectively refusing shelter to middle eastern people seeking asylum and safety? You fuckers don't get to celebrate Christmas.

Drinking Beverage

Of course I am not a Christian, but yea, the Joseph/Mary story would kinda say welcome travelers. But who cares right, gotta choose xenophobia and hate over lending aid to your fellow human.

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12-06-2017, 10:49 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(12-06-2017 09:31 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  For the record, Comey's testimony are perfectly in line with my assessment of the situation. As for impeachment? Based on what we know so far I think a court would have to rule that Trump's statements to Comey were meant to obstruct justice concerning Flynn, and I don't think his testimony is proof enough of that. I'm far from a lawyer though. Personally, I believe Comey, and believed him when the Republicans hated him, and when the Democrats hated him, and think the charge might be legit, but a man's word is not enough to convict. Nor does his testimony necessarily prove a crime if taken as fact, as there is sufficient room for interpretation (which Comey is well aware of based on his phrasing).

It will be enough when you take into account his long term behaviors. We know he lies all the time, it may take several hearings of his staff, but between those and Comey that can establish a pattern.

Not really different than a murder trial with no weapon or body. You can find other things like fingerprints, volume of blood, establish motive via life insurance policy and testimony from multiple witnesses who observe similar behaviors.

Trump fucking stinks and everyone knows it. If he is willing to sell the lie about the popular vote and his low inauguration turnout, he is certainly willing to lie about his intent.

But while right now you can argue legality, it still is not over and only time will tell. I think the fact Comey deflected Muller says it isn't over, and that glaring deflection says there is some serious smoke there.

Trump isn't listening to even his lawyers even now otherwise he would not be bringing more attention to himself by making such stupid Tweets after the fact. Say what you will about lack of evidence now, but Trump hopefully is too much of a narcissist he will hang himself.

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12-06-2017, 11:03 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
Can't get past the paywall but the Washington Post is reporting that D.C. and Maryland are suing Trump for, among other things, breaching the emolument's clause:

"...The lawsuit by the jurisdictions’ two Democratic attorneys general, the first of its kind brought by a government entity, alleges the president has breached his constitutional oath and could open a new front for Trump as he navigates dueling investigations by special counsel Robert S. Mueller III and congressional committees..."

Which means he will probably be compelled to release his taxes Banana_zorro

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12-06-2017, 11:11 AM
RE: The Trump Impeachment Thread
(12-06-2017 11:03 AM)Reducetarian Wrote:  Can't get past the paywall but the Washington Post is reporting that D.C. and Maryland are suing Trump for, among other things, breaching the emolument's clause:

Politico article, no paywall: http://www.politico.com/story/2017/06/12...-dc-239420
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