The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
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29-12-2015, 12:06 PM (This post was last modified: 29-12-2015 12:12 PM by WalkingSnake.)
The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Well, I don't know about ever. I would say "that I've seen", but again, I'm coming up on my 1 year anniversary of my professed atheism, so it's possible there are worse debates out there. I don't think there's a video yet that has gotten me more frustrated than this one:





Don't forget the Q&A part too:




First of all, the pic alone, before clicking play there, should give you an idea of why this debate went to Shitland, since you've got Sye Ten. I was just introduced to Sye's steamrolling tactics recently when I watched him debate Matt Dillahunty. But Matt at least held his own. This video also introduced me to Jeff Durbin, who is really just a young and more charismatic version of Sye. Jeff is the pastor of Apologia Church, which that name does give me the idea that Jeff is more on the offensive with dealing with skepticism. And as evidence to this I searched for Jeff Durbin and got tons of videos of him debating other atheists. I don't know how long Jeff has been at this, but he seems to have been lucky so far since the only videos of him interacting with opposing views has him seemingly pwning it.

Secondly, the video is called "Best". But of course from whose perspective? It was posted by Branch of Hope Church's youtube channel. If Christians were hoping for the true life version of the debate of "God's Not Dead", this is probably it.

Now the tactics used by the Christians in this debate are frustrating enough. They used the "always ask questions" method which is Page 1 out of the Christians "How to Debate an Atheist" handbook (I don't know if that's a real book, but I do remember that from my former Christian days, a lot of leaders would say that that's how you debate atheists). And yes, at several points you want to punch Sye or Jeff in the balls especially when they do this thing where they ask the atheists a question and when they don't get the simple answer that they deem acceptable they sit back defiantly and go, "Thank you" as if to say, "Aaaand I rest my case. I'm the fucking winner."

But the most frustrating part of this debate, and probably why Branch of Hope claims this to be the "Best Debate... Ever", is the atheist table.

I mean Goddammit, have you ever watched someone else play a videogame, and you're just like, "NO! Why are you going there? Go.... go left! Look! It's right fucking there! Omigod. Okay, yeah and now you're dead. Good job." That's what it's like to watch this video.

Bruce Gleason's opening statement had a lot of good points, but was plagued by his frustration with the technical issues of his slide show. That shouldn't be something that hurts the actual content of what Bruce had to say, but I can see how this would end up making the atheist side not have a very good open. Especially when Jeff Durbin gave a very smooth and charismatic opener. Then Andrew Breeding's rebuttal was high on nerves and hard to follow. But this was just tip of the iceberg.

Probably the best part of the debate was Sean Taylor's closing remarks. I think he did a solid job, but the reason I bring it up now is because I think he sort of nailed it on the head why this debate was just... so bad. He said (1:46:11), "I'm still confused.... I thought that they were going to have a debate here. But what they've done so far is said 'I win. You can't think. You can't be moral. And we win. We don't have to show it, because just you being here proves it.'" But while I was hoping that was Sean coming to a realization about the tactics from their Christian opponents, he didn't let that modify his own game plan.

The atheists here let themselves get backed into a corner. Because it seemed evident to me that the Christians came prepared. They came with a strategy. And the strategy was simply: steamroll the atheists by always being the one asking the questions. The Christians never, NEVER once offered any positive evidence for why they believe in God. And when the atheists were able to ask the questions, the Christians barely answered and quickly turned back to being the questioners. Often using the ever annoying "let me answer you by asking another question" routine. (Sye apparently is known for this. There's a podcast recording on youtube where Sye calls in to an atheist show guest starring Aron Ra, and often Aron and friends would ask Sye a question and it was like pulling teeth from an alligator to get Sye to answer).

And of course, what was the issue that the atheists let themselves get most backed into the corner with? Morality. MORALITY! "Eating babies" came up like 6 or 7 times throughout the entire 2 videos. Facepalm Eating fucking babies!

The atheists never got the upper hand here. Not once did one of them think to ask the Christians, "Hey, why do YOU think eating babies is wrong? Oh, God says so? Why does God say so? SO.... WHAT?" (referencing another annoying factoid of the night: Jeff's damn "So what?" T-shirt). Turn that bitch around on them. Never once did they point out the main difference between atheists and theists on morality: the fact that "because I said so" is not fucking good enough to determine morality for society.

And look, thinking about it now. It may not even be the atheists fault. From my perspective the atheists were trying to be the good guys and just present their case and actually have a sensible debate. They weren't ready for the steamroll team headed up by Jeff Durbin with Sye Ten as the copilot.

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29-12-2015, 12:20 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Quote:I mean Goddammit, have you ever watched someone else play a videogame, and you're just like, "NO! Why are you going there? Go.... go left! Look! It's right fucking there! Omigod. Okay, yeah and now you're dead. Good job." That's what it's like to watch this video.

That's a great description. I haven't even watched the debate, and I can feel your pain. Weeping

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29-12-2015, 01:03 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
(29-12-2015 12:06 PM)WalkingSnake Wrote:  Well, I don't know about ever. I would say "that I've seen", but again, I'm coming up on my 1 year anniversary of my professed atheism, so it's possible there are worse debates out there. I don't think there's a video yet that has gotten me more frustrated than this one:





Don't forget the Q&A part too:




First of all, the pic alone, before clicking play there, should give you an idea of why this debate went to Shitland, since you've got Sye Ten. I was just introduced to Sye's steamrolling tactics recently when I watched him debate Matt Dillahunty. But Matt at least held his own. This video also introduced me to Jeff Durbin, who is really just a young and more charismatic version of Sye. Jeff is the pastor of Apologia Church, which that name does give me the idea that Jeff is more on the offensive with dealing with skepticism. And as evidence to this I searched for Jeff Durbin and got tons of videos of him debating other atheists. I don't know how long Jeff has been at this, but he seems to have been lucky so far since the only videos of him interacting with opposing views has him seemingly pwning it.

Secondly, the video is called "Best". But of course from whose perspective? It was posted by Branch of Hope Church's youtube channel. If Christians were hoping for the true life version of the debate of "God's Not Dead", this is probably it.

Now the tactics used by the Christians in this debate are frustrating enough. They used the "always ask questions" method which is Page 1 out of the Christians "How to Debate an Atheist" handbook (I don't know if that's a real book, but I do remember that from my former Christian days, a lot of leaders would say that that's how you debate atheists). And yes, at several points you want to punch Sye or Jeff in the balls especially when they do this thing where they ask the atheists a question and when they don't get the simple answer that they deem acceptable they sit back defiantly and go, "Thank you" as if to say, "Aaaand I rest my case. I'm the fucking winner."

But the most frustrating part of this debate, and probably why Branch of Hope claims this to be the "Best Debate... Ever", is the atheist table.

I mean Goddammit, have you ever watched someone else play a videogame, and you're just like, "NO! Why are you going there? Go.... go left! Look! It's right fucking there! Omigod. Okay, yeah and now you're dead. Good job." That's what it's like to watch this video.

Bruce Gleason's opening statement had a lot of good points, but was plagued by his frustration with the technical issues of his slide show. That shouldn't be something that hurts the actual content of what Bruce had to say, but I can see how this would end up making the atheist side not have a very good open. Especially when Jeff Durbin gave a very smooth and charismatic opener. Then Andrew Breeding's rebuttal was high on nerves and hard to follow. But this was just tip of the iceberg.

Probably the best part of the debate was Sean Taylor's closing remarks. I think he did a solid job, but the reason I bring it up now is because I think he sort of nailed it on the head why this debate was just... so bad. He said (1:46:11), "I'm still confused.... I thought that they were going to have a debate here. But what they've done so far is said 'I win. You can't think. You can't be moral. And we win. We don't have to show it, because just you being here proves it.'" But while I was hoping that was Sean coming to a realization about the tactics from their Christian opponents, he didn't let that modify his own game plan.

The atheists here let themselves get backed into a corner. Because it seemed evident to me that the Christians came prepared. They came with a strategy. And the strategy was simply: steamroll the atheists by always being the one asking the questions. The Christians never, NEVER once offered any positive evidence for why they believe in God. And when the atheists were able to ask the questions, the Christians barely answered and quickly turned back to being the questioners. Often using the ever annoying "let me answer you by asking another question" routine. (Sye apparently is known for this. There's a podcast recording on youtube where Sye calls in to an atheist show guest starring Aron Ra, and often Aron and friends would ask Sye a question and it was like pulling teeth from an alligator to get Sye to answer).

And of course, what was the issue that the atheists let themselves get most backed into the corner with? Morality. MORALITY! "Eating babies" came up like 6 or 7 times throughout the entire 2 videos. Facepalm Eating fucking babies!

The atheists never got the upper hand here. Not once did one of them think to ask the Christians, "Hey, why do YOU think eating babies is wrong? Oh, God says so? Why does God say so? SO.... WHAT?" (referencing another annoying factoid of the night: Jeff's damn "So what?" T-shirt). Turn that bitch around on them. Never once did they point out the main difference between atheists and theists on morality: the fact that "because I said so" is not fucking good enough to determine morality for society.

And look, thinking about it now. It may not even be the atheists fault. From my perspective the atheists were trying to be the good guys and just present their case and actually have a sensible debate. They weren't ready for the steamroll team headed up by Jeff Durbin with Sye Ten as the copilot.

I just can't watch anything with Lie brugencate in it. I swell up, turn green, my clothes rip off and I become the incredible angry atheist.

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29-12-2015, 01:08 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Mr. Deity posted a timely video on this very subject.



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29-12-2015, 01:15 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
So I opened the first video, was impressed by the production values (decent cameras and sound, have the names of the guys unobtrusively on the screen, nice music, etc.).

Then Bruce got up, said the "atheism is..." stuff, and immediately started predicting what Sye would do, at which point I said "Oh fuck, it's gonna be one of those," and clicked over to a Dawkins interview.

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29-12-2015, 01:40 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Sye's tactics.

Atheist: (Insert Question)

Sye: I don't answer questions of Atheists.

Theist: (Insert Question)

Sye: Refer to scripture.

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29-12-2015, 01:53 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Sye is one of the worst theist "debaters" I've ever had the displeasure of hearing. A lot of atheists have stopped giving him a platform to spew his rhetoric.

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29-12-2015, 06:03 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
I stumbled thru close to 2 hours of it, but got lost when our guy started out telling us what the other guy was going to say! Silly at the least.
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29-12-2015, 06:07 PM (This post was last modified: 29-12-2015 06:12 PM by DerFish.)
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
(29-12-2015 06:03 PM)DerFish Wrote:  I stumbled thru close to 2 hours of it, but got lost when our guy started out telling us what the other guy was going to say! Silly at the least.

Oops Don't know what just happened here, but wanted to add that the eating babies argument is about the easiest thing to answer, and our guys seemed unprepared to handle it. "If the only thing that keeps you from eating babies is God above watching you to call you out on it i am sure glad you have Him. Hang on tight and don't lose Him because I'd hate to have you running around killing people and raping and all manner of other things that your belief is keeping in check."
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29-12-2015, 06:11 PM
RE: The WORST Debate Between Christians and Atheists Ever
Gods don't exist. So why bother watching debates about them? They are all the same.

There's no evidence. End of story.

Watch a movie or something. Go outside or pat the dog. Anything. Watching some idiot like Sye is beneath and unworthy of a rationalist IMO.

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