The big picture
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28-05-2011, 10:34 AM
RE: The big picture
(27-05-2011 01:56 PM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  
Quote:The Bible is God's highest revelation of himself but not his only one. He has revealed his existence through what he has created and he has given everyone an innate knowledge of right and wrong.

Really? So you were born with the innate knowledge that you shouldn't wear mixed fibers, cut the corners of your beard, work on the 7th day of the week, or touch a menstruating woman, and that you should kill homosexuals, unruly children, and atheists?
There are two kinds of commands given by God. There are universal moral laws that apply to everybody and there are specific commands that were only intended for specific individuals and groups. The examples you have given are of the second kind. They were laws given specifically to Israel. But the universal laws, such as those against stealing or murder, are known everywhere. Here is a more detailed explanation of the difference between the two kinds of commands:

http://www.christiandoctrinediscussion.c...ament.html

Quote:It's up to the parent, the teacher of morals, to make sure the children grow up correctly. God is either a malicious, homicidal maniac himself (and from the Old Testament we can confirm that yes, He is) or He is completely neglecting us to go have a beer and watch the Knicks game.
There are some children who continue to do wrong in spite of anything their parents do, and it appears that most humans are like this with regard to God.


Quote:Edit: and Kudos for being the longest lasting theist on this forum. I know that we can be a bit harsh at times and you never seem to resort to those derogatory methods that use the terms "typical atheists" or "you're all going to burn!"
Thank you


(27-05-2011 02:34 PM)Norseman Wrote:  [quote='theophilus' pid='32632' dateline='1306514904']Also, you have a strange idea of what a choice is. If your options are obedience or torture, it can hardly be called a choice.
Why not? Any time there are two options open to us we must choose betweem them and many of our choices are of this kind. We have the option of obeying the law or going to jail. We have the option of doing what our employer asks us to do or being fired. If we are suffering from a fatal disease we have the option of following our doctor's instructions or dying. Our choice of whether or not to obey God is just like many of the other choices we face in life.

God's invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made.
Romans 1:20 ESV

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28-05-2011, 10:48 AM
RE: The big picture
(28-05-2011 10:34 AM)theophilus Wrote:  Why not? Any time there are two options open to us we must choose betweem them and many of our choices are of this kind. We have the option of obeying the law or going to jail. We have the option of doing what our employer asks us to do or being fired. If we are suffering from a fatal disease we have the option of following our doctor's instructions or dying. Our choice of whether or not to obey God is just like many of the other choices we face in life.

There are differences here that you are ignoring.
Living in a democracy you also have the opportunity to work towards having laws changed if they are not to your fancy.
In professional life you have the opportunity to seek alternative employment if you employer is not to your fancy.
When it comes to fatal diseases you are right, we don't have a choice. It's do or die. Just as it is with Yahweh.

I'd like to see you try to answer my entire post please.

I want to rip off your superstitions and make passionate sense to you
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28-05-2011, 10:52 AM
RE: The big picture
(27-05-2011 10:48 AM)theophilus Wrote:  He created beings who were perfect but who had the free will and could choose whether or not to obey him. All the evils in the world came about because some chose to disobey.

You mean aside from the evil demons that God himself set on people, or the times when he stepped in and made people act in a certain way just to get the job (usually more killing) done?

(27-05-2011 10:48 AM)theophilus Wrote:  The Bible is God's highest revelation of himself but not his only one. He has revealed his existence through what he has created and he has given everyone an innate knowledge of right and wrong.

Strangely, this is a knowledge that he himself seems to lack.

Why won't God heal amputees?
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