The concept of forgiveness
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11-10-2014, 01:19 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
(11-10-2014 11:33 AM)Anjele Wrote:  Forgiving is one thing. Resentment can eat you up. If you can forgive and let the resentment go it's a lot better for you.

Allowing someone to stay in your life when you just have to keep forgiving over and over isn't a good thing. That's allowing yourself to be abused.

Forgive but don't forget. At least don't forget to the point that you open yourself up to more of the same.

Being a doormat means people will wipe their feet on you over and over again.

As an atheist I think forgiveness is more essential to living than a theist's since this is the one and only life we have. I find that religious people say they forgive others but underneath it all they believe the person that wronged them will burn in hell so there is the sweat revenge of god to back them up.

My religious sister hasn't spoken to me in 7 years after she tried to have my husband arrested the day after my father died. ( It's a very long story which I might go into later) She moved without giving me her phone number, new email and home address so there is no way for me to contact her. She doesn't do facebook either. She has my email address, phone number and address yet she can't let go of her resentment and hate to get in touch with me.

My sister is a somewhat inflexible, rather humorous person and maybe I find humor is too much of life, which maybe is a failing of mine. We were never close but I never hated her. We simply have different personalities and that's no ones fault. But I'm faced with a sister who will most likely take her hate and resentment to her grave and it's very, very sad.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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11-10-2014, 01:51 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
I was taught the "turn the other cheek" was meant as more a form of defiance. Slaves were to be backhanded, and if they turned the other cheek the master had to slap them with their palm. Treat me as an equal and slap me like a man, not a slave. I'll forgive you, but that does not make me inferior. I thought it was meant as a form of embarrassment towards the aggressor.

I have a feeling someone here knows the proper meaning behind this text used to manipulate Christians into submission no matter the atrocities committed against them.



I think that's what gives me such issue with my job - I'm expected to be a doormat and to hell with my self pride.


I tend to forgive several infractions - no one is perfect. However, there comes a breaking point when enough is enough, there's the door, get out of my life. You had your chances, now be on your way.

"If there's a single thing that life teaches us, it's that wishing doesn't make it so." - Lev Grossman
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11-10-2014, 01:54 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
I've got a lot shorter fuse than I used to, that's all I know. Used to really bend over backwards to try and get on with people... now I rather just forget them. They can have a happy life without me, I can be much better off without them.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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11-10-2014, 02:58 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
(11-10-2014 11:23 AM)Deidre32 Wrote:  Just wondering how you view it. Do you easily forgive those who wrong you? Do you require a contrite apology for offenses, before you forgive? Is full forgiveness of someone who is a repeat offender, at all possible? Finally, is forgiveness more about the person letting go who has been offended, than about the offender?

No. I do not easily forgive and often hold on to grudges; I'm an angry person. No; I just require those who have wronged me to recognises that they are wrong. It is possible, but I do not do it; I find it foolish to repeatedly forgive those who have displayed clear and consistent anti-me behaviour patterns. That depends on what you mean by 'more about'...

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11-10-2014, 04:41 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
(11-10-2014 12:17 PM)Logisch Wrote:  
(11-10-2014 12:01 PM)Deidre32 Wrote:  Sometimes, I just need to know I'm not being unreasonable. There's still that piece of me that doesn't trust my own decisions. (residue from Christianity again) I agree with you--the occasional blunder, I have been guilty of as well. No one is perfect, relationships and friendships go through ups and downs. But, to habitually humiliate or offend me, or mock me...I feel free having read all this feedback today. I haven't been able to unstick myself. Blush

It's totally OK to say no to people who cause you drama and problems. I learned this lesson the hard way about 5 or 6 years ago with someone who caused me not only a giant drama headache, but even attempted to pull me into a bunch of legal drama. I ended up drug into it due to total hearsay bullshit and it caused me issues reputation wise locally. I ended up hiring a lawyer for defamation and having to fire off some letters. It got incredibly ugly. I've never had to hire a lawyer for such things before, but I learned very quickly that people who incite drama are nothing I want anything to do with.

Thankfully that's gone and done and in the past and I never have to deal with it again. But still, I wish I could have avoided it altogether. It's likely that I could have, if I allowed myself to say "No, don't want anything to do with you." a lot sooner. Hard to forgive them for the drama of a mess, but I've allowed myself to just let it go over the years. However, I'll not forget it, because that is a behavior I will always warn myself to watch out for.

Wow, I'm so sorry to hear about all of that, but glad it's behind you. Hug
Why do you think we (in general) have a hard time saying 'no?' (even when our gut is warning us about someone early on)

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11-10-2014, 04:45 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
(11-10-2014 04:41 PM)Deidre32 Wrote:  
(11-10-2014 12:17 PM)Logisch Wrote:  It's totally OK to say no to people who cause you drama and problems. I learned this lesson the hard way about 5 or 6 years ago with someone who caused me not only a giant drama headache, but even attempted to pull me into a bunch of legal drama. I ended up drug into it due to total hearsay bullshit and it caused me issues reputation wise locally. I ended up hiring a lawyer for defamation and having to fire off some letters. It got incredibly ugly. I've never had to hire a lawyer for such things before, but I learned very quickly that people who incite drama are nothing I want anything to do with.

Thankfully that's gone and done and in the past and I never have to deal with it again. But still, I wish I could have avoided it altogether. It's likely that I could have, if I allowed myself to say "No, don't want anything to do with you." a lot sooner. Hard to forgive them for the drama of a mess, but I've allowed myself to just let it go over the years. However, I'll not forget it, because that is a behavior I will always warn myself to watch out for.

Wow, I'm so sorry to hear about all of that, but glad it's behind you. Hug
Why do you think we (in general) have a hard time saying 'no?' (even when our gut is warning us about someone early on)

Interesting you say that. Always at least take some time to listen to your gut. It's called instinct and we don't use it enough. You are picking up on cues that you don't even know your mind has registered.

If I have a strong gut reaction about someone I have found that I am right. Took a few kicks in the gut to learn that lesson but I finally learned it well.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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11-10-2014, 06:44 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
(11-10-2014 04:41 PM)Deidre32 Wrote:  
(11-10-2014 12:17 PM)Logisch Wrote:  It's totally OK to say no to people who cause you drama and problems. I learned this lesson the hard way about 5 or 6 years ago with someone who caused me not only a giant drama headache, but even attempted to pull me into a bunch of legal drama. I ended up drug into it due to total hearsay bullshit and it caused me issues reputation wise locally. I ended up hiring a lawyer for defamation and having to fire off some letters. It got incredibly ugly. I've never had to hire a lawyer for such things before, but I learned very quickly that people who incite drama are nothing I want anything to do with.

Thankfully that's gone and done and in the past and I never have to deal with it again. But still, I wish I could have avoided it altogether. It's likely that I could have, if I allowed myself to say "No, don't want anything to do with you." a lot sooner. Hard to forgive them for the drama of a mess, but I've allowed myself to just let it go over the years. However, I'll not forget it, because that is a behavior I will always warn myself to watch out for.

Wow, I'm so sorry to hear about all of that, but glad it's behind you. Hug
Why do you think we (in general) have a hard time saying 'no?' (even when our gut is warning us about someone early on)

What anjele said. It takes some time to get away from allowing emotion to ride over you and to allow instinct to kick in. I think more times than not, we want to hope for the best and give people the benefit of the doubt, due to either emotional attachment to them, or other reasons. Sometimes deep down you still have a bad feeling, but you proceed anyway.

Sometimes it sucks to allow emotion get put on the backburner, but sometimes doing so actually saves you more emotional headache/heartache down the road. If that makes sense.

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11-10-2014, 07:09 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
"gut feelings" and "instinct" are really just red flags we saw, but didn't stop to evaluate.

There are ALWAYS plenty of red flags when one enters into an abusive relationship of any kind. Maybe not the first day but well before the abuse. Like a magician, the abuser has us focus on other things while the abusiveness is right there on the surface.

We choose to ignore red flags because they do not fit the image we want to see.

They are always obvious in hind sight.

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11-10-2014, 09:14 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
Depends on what it is.

Forgiveness is one thing. Forgiveness is when you let them back in and forget whatever they did.

For all the major stuff, Forgetness is what is required. Simply ignore and shut them away. I forget what they did, but forget them in the process.


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11-10-2014, 09:26 PM
RE: The concept of forgiveness
I don't take much of anything personally because I recognize that people are little more than biochemical reaction driven machines, and free will therefore not part of the equation. That doesn't mean I won't make a logic driven choice to destroy them if their actions and goals are in conflict with mine, but it's not personal so, sure, I'll forgive them.

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