The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
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26-07-2015, 05:49 AM
The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
Sin is usually described as disobedience to what god says, it is also described as bad because it “separates us from god”.

This line of apologism immediately highlights several deficiencies of the Abrahamic god:

God can’t be in the presence of sin- not exactly omnipotent is he?

How could a god be separate from anything if it is omnipresent?

Why would this god need a separation from an instance of disobedience? How would separation do it any good if it is omniscient?

What purpose does hell serve if god is there (omnipresent) and fully aware (omniscient) of hell?

So the concept of sin refutes god’s alleged omni-attributes.

So if I’m buried in clothes made of polyester and cotton (a sin), then god will not be able to do anything to me after I die, I will render him powerless. Thumbsup

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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26-07-2015, 06:09 AM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
I understand your logic. Here's how we were taught in the good ole days:

Quote:God can’t be in the presence of sin- not exactly omnipotent is he?

The blood of the sacrifices (and later Jesus) covered that sin to allow him to be in the presence of the person bearing it. Still pretty fucked up.

Quote:What purpose does hell serve if god is there (omnipresent) and fully aware (omniscient) of hell?

I suspect apologists NEW way of answering the "omni's" would attempt to rebut this in that he "maximally omnipresent" or "maximally aware of hell" without being there? Just trying to think like a damn apologist but shooting from the hip.

**Crickets** -- God
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26-07-2015, 06:21 AM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 06:09 AM)Tonechaser77 Wrote:  I understand your logic. Here's how we were taught in the good ole days:

Quote:God can’t be in the presence of sin- not exactly omnipotent is he?

The blood of the sacrifices (and later Jesus) covered that sin to allow him to be in the presence of the person bearing it. Still pretty fucked up.

Quote:What purpose does hell serve if god is there (omnipresent) and fully aware (omniscient) of hell?

I suspect apologists NEW way of answering the "omni's" would attempt to rebut this in that he "maximally omnipresent" or "maximally aware of hell" without being there? Just trying to think like a damn apologist but shooting from the hip.

Yeah, of course "maximally" is defined as whatever they need it to be to hand-wave away inconsistencies.

Carrie is covered by the blood:

[Image: 04132012-carrie-remake.jpg]

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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26-07-2015, 07:25 AM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
It's almost never the case that the described attributes of the biblical or christian god relate to the omni-three/four labels of the "classical" terms of a god. The texts truthfully weren't written for that context but people in the current era get debated into having to make a case that their god is those things to make him absolute in status.. it just falls apart then.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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26-07-2015, 01:11 PM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
A newborn baby took that first breath, instantly became a sinner, & must begin atoning right away.....barf!
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26-07-2015, 03:04 PM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 01:11 PM)Mrs.B Wrote:  A newborn baby took that first breath, instantly became a sinner, & must begin atoning right away.....barf!

Remember that the bible says that god knew you while you were in the womb. So he already knew of all the times you were to touch your naughty parts and therefore knew whether you would burn or not. That is how much he loves you.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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26-07-2015, 03:23 PM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 03:04 PM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  
(26-07-2015 01:11 PM)Mrs.B Wrote:  A newborn baby took that first breath, instantly became a sinner, & must begin atoning right away.....barf!

Remember that the bible says that god knew you while you were in the womb. So he already knew of all the times you were to touch your naughty parts and therefore knew whether you would burn or not. That is how much he loves you.

We used to worship thunder/lightning storms, volcanoes, earthquakes, floods, etc., even tossing in human or animal sacrifices too, but we know how worship & prayer worked in those departments!
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26-07-2015, 04:15 PM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 03:23 PM)Mrs.B Wrote:  
(26-07-2015 03:04 PM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  Remember that the bible says that god knew you while you were in the womb. So he already knew of all the times you were to touch your naughty parts and therefore knew whether you would burn or not. That is how much he loves you.

We used to worship thunder/lightning storms, volcanoes, earthquakes, floods, etc., even tossing in human or animal sacrifices too, but we know how worship & prayer worked in those departments!

Well that was under the old covenant blah blah blah......Josephus!!!

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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26-07-2015, 04:23 PM
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 04:15 PM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  
(26-07-2015 03:23 PM)Mrs.B Wrote:  We used to worship thunder/lightning storms, volcanoes, earthquakes, floods, etc., even tossing in human or animal sacrifices too, but we know how worship & prayer worked in those departments!

Well that was under the old covenant blah blah blah......Josephus!!!

Ok, that's different then....hahahaha.
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26-07-2015, 07:20 PM (This post was last modified: 26-07-2015 07:23 PM by Alla.)
RE: The concept of sin contradicts god’s alleged attributes
(26-07-2015 05:49 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Sin is usually described as disobedience to what god says, it is also described as bad because it “separates us from god”.
This line of apologism immediately highlights several deficiencies of the Abrahamic god:
God can’t be in the presence of sin- not exactly omnipotent is he?
Yes, he can be in the presence of sin if He wants to. Separation from God doesn't mean that sinner can not see God once in a while. Some mortals saw Him. Separation from God means that sinner can not be with God anytime he or she wants.
(26-07-2015 05:49 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  How could a god be separate from anything if it is omnipresent?
Omnipresent doesn't mean that He is everywhere at the same time(it would be absurd). Omnipresent(according to Him) is that He can be anywhere He wants to or anywhere He needs to when He wants or needs to be( both literally or figuratively).
(26-07-2015 05:49 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Why would this god need a separation from an instance of disobedience?
God doesn't need it. We need it. Veil/separation is to protect sinner(mortal man).
Mortal man can not be next to the source of high radiation and live. God is Light. His glorified resurrected body is source of great light and great radiation. Man(mortal) can not see God and live after that.
(26-07-2015 05:49 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  What purpose does hell serve if god is there (omnipresent) and fully aware (omniscient) of hell?
There are no Gods in hell. They are in the place called Heaven.
But if God wants to visit hell He can . God Son did visit hell between His death and resurrection.
(26-07-2015 05:49 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  So the concept of sin refutes god’s alleged omni-attributes.
Not at all if you know what God means when He says that He is Omni-something.

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
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