The cost of atheism
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27-08-2014, 11:42 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 10:33 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Can someone give me the gist of what this new guys believes about homosexuality?

(27-08-2014 08:48 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  It is obviously against nature, it is obviously bad for people's individual health, and it is obviously bad for society in terms of gay adoption etc, and for the propagation of the species. It flies in the face of evolution.

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27-08-2014, 11:42 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:17 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 10:54 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  Brian, I dont understand your response here. I am asked questions about what the Bible says, which I answer, and you respond by saying that "we don't care what part of that book you quote" If you don't want answers then perhaps don't ask questions?

Well, he didn't ask any questions about the Bible. Some others did. You have to be aware that there are different kinds of people here. Some are atheists who have no interest at all in the Bible -- it's just another work of fiction, and in their opinion, a badly-written one. Others (like Bucky Ball) are Biblical scholars who probably know as much or more about the Bible as you do, and are quite willing to discuss it -- but they don't accept it as the "Word of God". Others, like kingschosen, are actually theists who "believe in" the Bible (but may interpret it differently than you do). I'm willing to discuss it on its own terms, even though I'm an atheist. I will not be as confrontational as Bucky Ball (nor as knowledgeable), but like him, I don't accept it as the Word of God. I do find it an interesting book, and worthy of discussion.

And then there are some who will just want to beat on you because you're a theist. You can always just ignore those people.

That was a refreshing post Grasshopper, thanks. Happy to chat with you.
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27-08-2014, 11:43 AM (This post was last modified: 27-08-2014 04:53 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:39 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 11:10 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Look at this clown. This is going to be a slaughter once GWOG and Bucky go all Divinity college on him. The Bible was completed 2000 years ago!!!!!! It was despite that fact that most of the books were not even written til the 2nd or even 3rd century. What an ignoramus. Ok I don't have to bother with this fool at all as he knows nothing about his faith or his book.

Its such a shame to come here and just be called a fool, an ignoramus, a prat. Guys, your not selling atheism very well. Your just unpleasant not nice people, who seem incapable of reasonable and rational discussion. Do I have to be the enemy just because I am a chrisitan? I have friends who are atheists, we manage not to shoot each other. Yes, I disagree with you, and? Is that life threatening to you, are you insecure in your beliefs? I don't get it. I was hoping to make friends here.

Liar.
You decided to come here, and make a claim YOU were unable to support. Don't go all *victim* on us, poor baby. No one here has to sell anything. Your life is your own. If YOU choose delusion, that's your problem. "Reasoned discussion" is *agree with me or you're not reasonable*. What a whiney fraud you are. You can support NOTHING you say. You know NOTHING about the Bible or science, or anything else. So, now you play the victim card. Really ? You fraud. You think THAT is how to make friends. What a joke you are.

And BTW, every species on the planet engages in same-sex behaviors, so your "against nature" crap just shows how ignorant you are of science.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/200...122106.htm
Thre are no studies that show children of same-sex couples do worse than any others. So you have no facts there either.
If it were non compatible with Evolution, it would have been selected out. Yet here it remains. About that brain you were going to grow ... are you working on that ?

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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27-08-2014, 11:44 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:39 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  Its such a shame to come here and just be called a fool, an ignoramus, a prat. Guys, your not selling atheism very well. Your just unpleasant not nice people, who seem incapable of reasonable and rational discussion. Do I have to be the enemy just because I am a chrisitan? I have friends who are atheists, we manage not to shoot each other. Yes, I disagree with you, and? Is that life threatening to you, are you insecure in your beliefs? I don't get it. I was hoping to make friends here.

call this man a whambulance.

Darling, you came here, basically told us that we are responsible for all the world's troubles, and expect to get a warm welcome?

How often have you walked into a strangers house, took a look around, and declared (loudly), that this is a shit show? I mean, just because this is the internet and you can hide behind anonymity, you think its still the right thing to do? Get real.

Further, we have nothing to sell you. Atheism requires no membership. We do not seek to convert other people. You are welcome to your beliefs and to your observance of those beliefs. So long as it stays inside its own bubble and does not interfere with our lives. Its when it bubbles outside of its own pious observance and spills into things like social policy that we have the problem.

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
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27-08-2014, 11:45 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:42 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 11:17 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  Well, he didn't ask any questions about the Bible. Some others did. You have to be aware that there are different kinds of people here. Some are atheists who have no interest at all in the Bible -- it's just another work of fiction, and in their opinion, a badly-written one. Others (like Bucky Ball) are Biblical scholars who probably know as much or more about the Bible as you do, and are quite willing to discuss it -- but they don't accept it as the "Word of God". Others, like kingschosen, are actually theists who "believe in" the Bible (but may interpret it differently than you do). I'm willing to discuss it on its own terms, even though I'm an atheist. I will not be as confrontational as Bucky Ball (nor as knowledgeable), but like him, I don't accept it as the Word of God. I do find it an interesting book, and worthy of discussion.

And then there are some who will just want to beat on you because you're a theist. You can always just ignore those people.

That was a refreshing post Grasshopper, thanks. Happy to chat with you.

We are not the grasshoppers and you are not our teacher. We are educated too and can read your book or any holy book just like you.

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27-08-2014, 11:45 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:24 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 11:22 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  I didn't use Utilitarianism to support my religion. I playing devil's advocate to show that atheism doesn't work.

Bullshit.
Works fine for me, and countless others. YOU said morality comes from religion, and that's a good thing. THAT IS "utilitarian", if that is true. Please grow a brain, soon.


Bucky, I don't know if you caught my other post so I will repeat it here. I find you rude and unpleasant. You seem link a very angry and unhappy man. I don't think atheism is working for you. I will not engage with you again as you seem incapable of being civil.
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27-08-2014, 11:45 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:28 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  So Phil, your argument to Russia (including atheists) and to Islam is that you are right about homosexulaity because your smarter than they are? I seem to recall Hitler thinking a similar thing. I find it hard to believe that you are giving that as a serious answer.


If I am correct, you will find it impossible to believe.

If you are at pre-rational levels of moral development (as I think you are), the possibility of ethical discernment will be fundamentally out of your sight.

I'm not going to debate this with you, because of your level of moral development it would result in a circular argument.

Phil
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27-08-2014, 11:46 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:45 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 11:24 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Bullshit.
Works fine for me, and countless others. YOU said morality comes from religion, and that's a good thing. THAT IS "utilitarian", if that is true. Please grow a brain, soon.


Bucky, I don't know if you caught my other post so I will repeat it here. I find you rude and unpleasant. You seem link a very angry and unhappy man. I don't think atheism is working for you. I will not engage with you again as you seem incapable of being civil.

Again, what the hell does atheism have to do with one's level of happiness?!?

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day - Bill Watterson
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27-08-2014, 11:47 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:38 AM)CiderThinker Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 11:18 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  Two things then:

1. Can you give me examples of the teachings of Jesus that are immoral?

2. On what basis do you say they are immoral?

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, in singleness of heart, as you obey Christ;

Tells slaves to accept their place as slaves.

That one is cheating, because Jesus didn't say it -- Paul did. I don't recall Jesus saying anything in support of slavery.

However, I would cite Jesus's teaching about Hell. The very concept of Hell is immoral -- infinite punishment for finite crimes. Even for someone like Hitler, who everyone agrees was evil, Hell would be excessive. But to eternally torture someone simply because he/she had "wrong" beliefs, or worshipped God in the "wrong" way -- that is not only immoral, it's disgustingly so.
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27-08-2014, 11:48 AM
RE: The cost of atheism
(27-08-2014 11:00 AM)ChristianMan Wrote:  
(27-08-2014 09:47 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  It's "you're missing", not your. Hmm, Education much ?
Morality does not come from the gods. Another unsupported assertion. YOU morality is no more "objective" than anyone else's, and has CHANGED along with the morality of the cultures which produced it, and in which is exists.

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...rah?page=2
Post 19.
The opinions of some REAL scholars on the subject. None of which you can refute.

Bucky, diversion to my grammar will not hold as a valid answer to my question, to which of course you have no valid answer.

We have had a completed Bible for 2000 years now, unchanged. Why do you say we do not have a set moral standard? Do not murder, do no lie, do not steel, ring any bells? My stance here on homosexuality is based on the Bible, so I have no clue what you are on about.

No you do not and no it has not. The bible was not compiled until after the council of Nicea and has been revised, reinterpreted, etc many, many times since then. The included works were still being shuffled until the 1500's. Even the various Christian denomination do not agree on what version of the bible to use. Catholics use one, protestants use another, eastern rite uses another, etc..

You were saying?
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