The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
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15-03-2014, 05:12 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
Yes it is pure slavery. Religion enslaves most of those who believe it. Religion is meant to hold down the masses so that the leaders of each religion can stack paper to the ceiling. Eric and Kent Hovind are slave owners, Zakir Naik is a slave owner, Michael Cremo is a slave owner. All these men make millions off of people who will listen and never question. One can say the same about dawkins but I question everything dawkins says and if he is wrong I will say he was wrong before a religious person can move his lips. We need to break the bonds of this slavery, a slavery to the religion and the leaders of them

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[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] ♪僕は恐怖の一定した状態に住んで、不幸、逃すもう?僕は、それはもう痛いときも気づかないと
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15-03-2014, 05:43 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
If you were to suddenly decide to NEVER lie to your child there is a long list of things that you would have to remove from their lives:

Santa Claus
The Easter Bunny
The Tooth Fairy
All the classic fairy tales
Aesop's Fables
Dr. Suess
Cartoons
Comics
Magic Shows
Religion
Advertising
Reality shows
The list is nearly endless.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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15-03-2014, 07:55 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
(15-03-2014 05:43 PM)Anjele Wrote:  If you were to suddenly decide to NEVER lie to your child there is a long list of things that you would have to remove from their lives:

Santa Claus
The Easter Bunny
The Tooth Fairy
All the classic fairy tales
Aesop's Fables
Dr. Suess
Cartoons
Comics
Magic Shows
Religion
Advertising
Reality shows
The list is nearly endless.

Some of these things are not like the others Miss Anj. God is the only one woven into the fabric of their day to day lives forever, even Santa falls by the wayside early on. No parent I ever heard of tells kids that Wile E. Coyote was keeping an eye on them to see if they deserved presents or that The Cat in the Hat would punish them for masturbating.

Parents tell their kids those are actors on the TV, magic is just sleight of hand and Mickey Mouse is a made-up character. Only the God story persists into adulthood replete with solemn ceremonies, promises of love and threats of brimstone.

I just don't see all those things on your list as carrying the same weight IMO.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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15-03-2014, 08:21 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
I went to a Lutheran school K-9. I'm a big fan of parochial schools. Nothing better to turn out the next generation of atheists than a parochial education.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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15-03-2014, 08:41 PM (This post was last modified: 15-03-2014 09:26 PM by Anjele.)
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
(15-03-2014 07:55 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(15-03-2014 05:43 PM)Anjele Wrote:  If you were to suddenly decide to NEVER lie to your child there is a long list of things that you would have to remove from their lives:

Santa Claus
The Easter Bunny
The Tooth Fairy
All the classic fairy tales
Aesop's Fables
Dr. Suess
Cartoons
Comics
Magic Shows
Religion
Advertising
Reality shows
The list is nearly endless.

Some of these things are not like the others Miss Anj. God is the only one woven into the fabric of their day to day lives forever, even Santa falls by the wayside early on. No parent I ever heard of tells kids that Wile E. Coyote was keeping an eye on them to see if they deserved presents or that The Cat in the Hat would punish them for masturbating.

Parents tell their kids those are actors on the TV, magic is just sleight of hand and Mickey Mouse is a made-up character. Only the God story persists into adulthood replete with solemn ceremonies, promises of love and threats of brimstone.

I just don't see all those things on your list as carrying the same weight IMO.

When my son was in 2nd grade his teacher said that he was one of the few that understood the difference between real and imaginary. It's scarier out there than you think. A kid who doesn't realize that the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles aren't real is more likely to buy into other imaginary characters.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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15-03-2014, 09:25 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
I don't think either way is particularly harmful or beneficial. I personally told my children Santa clause was not real. What I have learned is if you don't give your child magic they will invent their own lol. At the same time I love that my 5 year old can not be fooled by most grown ups. She has a quick mind and she isn't afraid to tell an adult just exactly why they're wrong. I fear that kindergarten is going to be a difficult year!

When I was a kid promising a lie was like the ultimate sin in our house. I remember my mom always telling me that sometimes grown ups can't tell kids everything, but no matter what she would never promise unless it was the truth. So I will never forget the day she promised me that Santa was real, or the Christmas that we snuck down and saw my dad putting Christmas presents under the tree. I will never forget how my mother cried when I told her she was a liar and I would never trust her again. I think it probably traumatized her more than it did me. As long as I got my presents I was happy. I learned a valuable lesson that day. People lie. No matter how much they love us and no matter how much we count on them, people lie. It's not always done to hurt you it's just a part of human nature.

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15-03-2014, 11:37 PM
The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
I figured out the Santa Claus Easter bunny stuff on my own early on without asking questions it was just clear to me my mother would do her best to keep me from telling my little brothers. I don't think the Santa Claus Easter bunny stuff should be pushed as real it should be just a fun thing for kids and if they figure it out so be it however on the subject of fairy tales in general i think there's nothing better for growing imaginations

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15-03-2014, 11:46 PM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
(15-03-2014 11:37 PM)dex.me Wrote:  I figured out the Santa Claus Easter bunny stuff on my own early on without asking questions it was just clear to me my mother would do her best to keep me from telling my little brothers. I don't think the Santa Claus Easter bunny stuff should be pushed as real it should be just a fun thing for kids and if they figure it out so be it however on the subject of fairy tales in general i think there's nothing better for growing imaginations

That's kinda how it was for us kids too. My mom and dad went along with all of it, but it was so much more of an exciting game for all of us that even after I figured it out, I don't think I ever really had a discussion with them about it. I just kind of "got it" and kept playing along. It was nothing but a fun thing to pretend.

I think the biggest difference b/w Santa and the Easter bunny et al. and god is (and I've heard it said before) that once you figure out that they're not real, you still get to keep the presents and candy so whatever. Tongue

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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16-03-2014, 12:46 AM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
Hmm. Your example of getting super-lied to after being lied to first actually is better IMO. Now you learn that even after you devise an experiment the results may need to be viewed with more skepticism. People may lie etc. *Even* people that you'd think have no reason to lie or are too good to lie. People like pastors Dodgy Valuable life lesson.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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16-03-2014, 12:54 AM
RE: The fairy tale con - does it hurt kids?
(16-03-2014 12:46 AM)morondog Wrote:  People like pastors Dodgy

Careful. My daddy is a pastor. I don't feel that he's ever lied to me.....intentionally. (Except santa claus and the tooth fairy, but we've been over that)

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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