The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
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21-10-2016, 07:38 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
When my friend and I went up to visit Alice at the restaurant.
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21-10-2016, 07:39 AM (This post was last modified: 21-10-2016 07:52 AM by Loom.)
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:28 AM)theBorg Wrote:  
(21-10-2016 07:05 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  ........... you believe the Earth is a few thousand years old despite the evidence.
...........

Rejection of the True Science is sin. I am not sinning. Look:

Quote:..... researchers have calculated that “mitochondrial Eve”—the woman whose mtDNA was ancestral to that in all living people—lived 100,000 to 200,000 years ago in Africa. Using the new clock, she would be a mere 6000 years old.

Peer-reviewed, the famous top journal: Science

Did you even read the article? Aside from what you wanted to read?

The very next paragraph they say it is unlikely, and the date in which they suspect humans to have started living in North America has be revised to 34,000 years ago.

The 6,000 years merely describes the rate at which mutations typically occur so the youngest 'mitochondrial eve' could be is 6,000 years old but it's extremely unlikely.

Edit: wow I didn't even read the date of the article. Seariously, quoting a 20 year old paper?

Ignorance is not to be ignored.

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21-10-2016, 07:39 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
Additionally:

Quote:Mitochondrial Eve is named after mitochondria and the biblical Eve. The title of "Mitochondrial Eve" is not permanently fixed to a single individual, but rather shifts forward in time over the course of human history as maternal lineages become extinct. Unlike her biblical namesake, she was not the only living human female of her time. However, by the definition of Mitochondrial Eve, her female contemporaries, though they may have descendants alive today, do not have any descendants today who descend in an unbroken female line of descent.

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21-10-2016, 07:40 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:37 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  That article is from 1997 you Dumb ****.
It's nearly 20 years old.

Something a bit more current

Quote:Mitochondrial Eve
In human genetics, the Mitochondrial Eve is the matrilineal most recent common ancestor (MRCA) of all currently living humans. This is the most recent woman from whom all living humans today descend, in an unbroken line, on their mother’s side, and through the mothers of those mothers, and so on, back until all lines converge on one woman, who is estimated to have lived approximately 100,000–200,000 years ago.

Moron.

The quote is from Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not the serious source! The journal "Science" is the serious source!
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21-10-2016, 07:44 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:37 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(21-10-2016 07:28 AM)theBorg Wrote:  Rejection of the True Science is sin. I am not sinning. Look:


Peer-reviewed, the famous top journal: Science

That article is from 1997 you Dumb Fuck.
It's nearly 20 years old.

Something a bit more current

Quote:Mitochondrial Eve
In human genetics, the Mitochondrial Eve is the matrilineal most recent common ancestor (MRCA) of all currently living humans. This is the most recent woman from whom all living humans today descend, in an unbroken line, on their mother’s side, and through the mothers of those mothers, and so on, back until all lines converge on one woman, who is estimated to have lived approximately 100,000–200,000 years ago.

Moron.

More importantly, “mitochondrial Eve” is NOT the first woman. If something wiped out most of the population of the world the title “mitochondrial Eve” would pass to a much more recent woman. I wish the scientists would stop using religious allusions like this (and 'the god particle') since it gets the fundies all hot and flustered thinking that science is supporting their bullshit when it clearly is not.

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21-10-2016, 07:46 AM (This post was last modified: 21-10-2016 07:51 AM by Loom.)
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:40 AM)theBorg Wrote:  
(21-10-2016 07:37 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  That article is from 1997 you Dumb ****.
It's nearly 20 years old.

Something a bit more current


Moron.

The quote is from Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not the serious source! The journal "Science" is the serious source!
It'd be an insult to bricks if I said you had them for brains.

That article was written in 1998, almost two whole decades ago. Read a current article and come back to us (and while I agree Wikipedia isn't an end-all meets-all source, it is still a pretty darn good source, and you can always cross-check their references).

And mitochondial-eve is not who you think she is. Look up Y-chromosomal-Adam.

Ignorance is not to be ignored.

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21-10-2016, 07:47 AM
RE: lying troll
(21-10-2016 07:40 AM)theBorg Wrote:  The quote is from Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not the serious source! The journal "Science" is the serious source!

References and citations. I know that's a foreign concept to you, but...

Quote:References

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Further reading[edit]

Atkinson, QD; Gray, RD; Drummond, AJ (January 2009), "Bayesian coalescent inference of major human mitochondrial DNA haplogroup expansions in Africa", Proceedings of the Royal Society B: Biological Sciences, 276 (1655): 367–73, doi:10.1098/rspb.2008.0785, PMC 2674340free to read, PMID 18826938
Ayala, F (1995), "The myth of Eve:molecular biology and human origin", Science, 270 (5244): 1930–1936, Bibcode:1995Sci...270.1930A, doi:10.1126/science.270.5244.1930, PMID 8533083
Balloux, F; Handley, LJ; Jombart, T; Liu, H; Manica, A (2009), "Climate shaped the worldwide distribution of human mitochondrial DNA sequence variation", Proc Biol Sci., 276 (1672): 3447–55, doi:10.1098/rspb.2009.0752, PMC 2817182free to read, PMID 19586946
Behar, D; Villems; Soodyall; Blue-Smith; Pereira; Metspalu; Scozzari; Makkan; Tzur (May 2008), "The dawn of human matrilineal diversity", American Journal of Human Genetics, 82 (5): 1130–40, doi:10.1016/j.ajhg.2008.04.002, PMC 2427203free to read, PMID 18439549
Brown, WM (June 1980), "Polymorphism in mitochondrial DNA of humans as revealed by restriction endonuclease analysis", Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. U.S.A., 77 (6): 3605–9, Bibcode:1980PNAS...77.3605B, doi:10.1073/pnas.77.6.3605, PMC 349666free to read, PMID 6251473
Cann, RL; Stoneking, M; Wilson, AC (1987), "Mitochondrial DNA and human evolution", Nature, 325 (6099): 31–6, Bibcode:1987Natur.325...31C, doi:10.1038/325031a0, PMID 3025745
Cox, MP (August 2008), "Accuracy of molecular dating with the rho statistic: deviations from coalescent expectations under a range of demographic models", Hum. Biol., 80 (4): 335–57, doi:10.3378/1534-6617-80.4.335, PMID 19317593
Dawkins, Richard (2004), The ancestor's tale: a pilgrimage to the dawn of evolution, Boston: Houghton Mifflin, ISBN 0-618-00583-8
Endicott, P; Ho, SY (April 2008), "A Bayesian evaluation of human mitochondrial substitution rates", Am. J. Hum. Genet., 82 (4): 895–902, doi:10.1016/j.ajhg.2008.01.019, PMC 2427281free to read, PMID 18371929
Endicott, P; Ho, SY; Metspalu, M; Stringer, C (September 2009), "Evaluating the mitochondrial timescale of human evolution", Trends Ecol. Evol. (Amst.), 24 (9): 515–21, doi:10.1016/j.tree.2009.04.006, PMID 19682765
Excoffier, L; Yang, Z (October 1999), "Substitution rate variation among sites in mitochondrial hypervariable region I of humans and chimpanzees", Mol. Biol. Evol., 16 (10): 1357–68, doi:10.1093/oxfordjournals.molbev.a026046, PMID 10563016
Felsenstein, J (April 1992), "Estimating effective population size from samples of sequences: inefficiency of pairwise and segregating sites as compared to phylogenetic estimates", Genet. Res., 59 (2): 139–47, doi:10.1017/S0016672300030354, PMID 1628818
Ferris, SD; Brown, WM; Davidson, WS; Wilson, AC (October 1981), "Extensive polymorphism in the mitochondrial DNA of apes", Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. U.S.A., 78 (10): 6319–23, Bibcode:1981PNAS...78.6319F, doi:10.1073/pnas.78.10.6319, PMC 349030free to read, PMID 6273863
Gibbons, Anne (January 1998), "Calibrating the mitochondrial clock", Science, 279 (5347): 28–9, Bibcode:1998Sci...279...28G, doi:10.1126/science.279.5347.28, PMID 9441404
Gonder, MK; Mortensen, HM; Reed, FA; de Sousa, A; Tishkoff, SA (December 2007), "Whole-mtDNA genome sequence analysis of ancient African lineages", Mol. Biol. Evol, 24 (3): 757–68, doi:10.1093/molbev/msl209, PMID 17194802
Hazelwood, L; Steele, J (2004), "Spatial dynamics of human dispersals: Constraints on modelling and archaeological validation", Journal of Archaeological Science, 31 (6): 669–679, doi:10.1016/j.jas.2003.11.009
Ho, SY; Larson, G (February 2006), "Molecular clocks: when times are a-changin'", Trends Genet., 22 (2): 79–83, doi:10.1016/j.tig.2005.11.006, PMID 16356585
Ingman, M; Kaessmann, H; Pääbo, S; Gyllensten, U (December 2000), "Mitochondrial genome variation and the origin of modern humans", Nature, 408 (6813): 708–13, doi:10.1038/35047064, PMID 11130070
Kaessmann, H; Pääbo, S (January 2002), "The genetical history of humans and the great apes", J. Intern. Med., 251 (1): 1–18, doi:10.1046/j.1365-2796.2002.00907.x, PMID 11851860
Loogväli, Eva-Liis; Kivisild, Toomas; Margus, Tõnu; Villems, Richard; O'Rourke, Dennis; et al. (2009), O'Rourke, Dennis, ed., "Explaining the Imperfection of the Molecular Clock of Hominid Mitochondria", PLoS ONE, 4 (12): e8260, Bibcode:2009PLoSO...4.8260L, doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0008260, PMC 2794369free to read, PMID 20041137
Kimura, Motoo; Ohta, Tomoko (2001), Theoretical Aspects of Population Genetics, Princeton University Press, p. 232, ISBN 0-691-08098-4
Loewe, L; Scherer, S (November 1997), "Mitochondrial Eve: The Plot Thickens", Trends in Ecology & Evolution, 12 (11): 422–3, doi:10.1016/S0169-5347(97)01204-4
Maca-Meyer, N; González, AM; Larruga, JM; Flores, C; Cabrera, VM (2001), "Major genomic mitochondrial lineages delineate early human expansions", BMC Genet., 2 (1): 13, doi:10.1186/1471-2156-2-13, PMC 55343free to read, PMID 11553319
Mishmar, D; Ruiz-Pesini, E; Golik, P; Macaulay, V; Clark, AG; Hosseini, S; Brandon, M; Easley, K; et al. (January 2003), "Natural selection shaped regional mtDNA variation in humans", Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. U.S.A., 100 (1): 171–6, Bibcode:2002PNAS..100..171M, doi:10.1073/pnas.0136972100, PMC 140917free to read, PMID 12509511
Nei, M (November 1992), "Age of the common ancestor of human mitochondrial DNA", Mol. Biol. Evol., 9 (6): 1176–8, PMID 1435241
Nielsen, R; Beaumont, MA (March 2009), "Statistical inferences in phylogeography", Mol. Ecol., 18 (6): 1034–47, doi:10.1111/j.1365-294X.2008.04059.x, PMID 19207258
Oppenheimer, Stephen (2004), The Real Eve: Modern Man's Journey Out of Africa, New York: Carroll & Graf, ISBN 0-7867-1334-8
Parsons, TJ; Muniec, DS; Sullivan, K; Alliston-Greiner, R; Wilson, MR; Berry, DL; Holland, KA; Weedn, VW; et al. (April 1997), "A high observed substitution rate in the human mitochondrial DNA control region", Nat. Genet., 15 (4): 363–8, doi:10.1038/ng0497-363, PMID 9090380
Pritchard, JK; Seielstad, MT; Perez-Lezaun, A; Feldman, MW (1999), "Population growth of human Y chromosomes: a study of Y chromosome microsatellites.", Mol Biol Evol., 16 (12): 1791–98, doi:10.1093/oxfordjournals.molbev.a026091, PMID 10605120
Reed, FA; Tishkoff, SA (2006), "Africa human diversity, origins and migrations", Current Opinion in Genetics & Development, 16: 598, doi:10.1016/j.gde.2006.10.008, PMID 17056248
Rohde, DL; Olson, S; Chang, JT (September 2004), "Modelling the recent common ancestry of all living humans", Nature, 431 (7008): 562–6, Bibcode:2004Natur.431..562R, doi:10.1038/nature02842, PMID 15457259
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21-10-2016, 07:52 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:46 AM)Loom Wrote:  ........ Wikipedia isn't an end-all meets-all source, it is still a pretty darn good source, and you can always cross-check their references).

An mitochondial-eve is not who you think she is. Look up Y-chromosomal-Adam.

I hate to debunk True Theism (it is your "job"), so please give us the reference, which you talked about (the one in Wikipedia). And, please, tell us what is the "problem" with Adam.
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21-10-2016, 07:55 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
But Alice doesn't live in the restaurant, she lives in the church nearby the
Restaurant, in the bell tower with her husband Ray and Facha, the dog.
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21-10-2016, 08:02 AM
RE: The fine-tuning argument is very powerful. Many brave atheists were defeated. R.I.P.
(21-10-2016 07:47 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
Quote:References

1.Jump up ^ Pedro Soares et al 2009, Correcting for Purifying Selection: An Improved Human Mitochondrial Molecular Clock. and its Supplemental Data. The American Journal of Human Genetics, Volume 84, Issue 6, 740–759, 4 June 2009
2.Jump up ^ "Jordan: 'Mitochondrial Eve'". weber.ucsd.edu. 2011. Retrieved 7 January 2012.
3.^ Jump up to: a b Cann RL, Stoneking M, Wilson AC (1987), "Mitochondrial DNA and human evolution", Nature, 325 (6099): 31–36, ........

It is all a spam. Which reference has disproven the author in
http://science.sciencemag.org/content/27...-summaries
????
The reference must mention in the text the author and the paper.
See: the paper is in 1998-Science (the journal), so the disproval must mention this paper in 1998-Science. Or is there simply said: the author in Science is "moron"? Such accusation must be proven. Show me the proof of this accusation, please.
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