The foundational lie in the psyche
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18-07-2014, 07:22 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 05:48 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(18-07-2014 05:39 PM)childeye Wrote:  I'll say this. It's like watching Mozart have to listen to a lesson on the intricacies of the kazoo.

I see, so you would rather play stupid word games and feign ignorance than discuss biblical history? I have given you more chances than anyone on this board to fully explain yourself and yet you have each and every time either resorted to mangling the english language to force your theology with redefinitions or just flat out refused to answer questions. I think I am done discussing this topic with you. I do find you an agreeable sort outside of our theological differences so if you wish to engage elsewhere on the forum do not hesitate. Scroll through the other sections and you will find that despite not fawning over an imaginary celestial dictator we lead full and for the most part happy lives. But as I do not wish to become hostile I am going to leave this thread. I doubt I shall be back here.

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Okay, I said something wrong. I didn't mean anything by it. I appreciate your contribution to the thread. Even if it is always cynicism towards God, scripture.

Personally, I don't think you really discussed the topic that much. Do you know what the lie even is?
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18-07-2014, 08:01 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 05:39 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-07-2014 05:33 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Over your head?
I'll say this. It's like watching Mozart have to listen to a lesson on the intricacies of the kazoo.

Oh I see. So you actually think your equivocating garbage is somehow equal to "Mozart" and those that disagree with you are "kazoo players".

Perhaps the "foundational lie" is pride, just like yours. Drinking Beverage

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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18-07-2014, 08:32 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 07:22 PM)childeye Wrote:  Personally, I don't think you really discussed the topic that much. Do you know what the lie even is?

Are you going to tell us?

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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18-07-2014, 08:43 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 08:01 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(18-07-2014 05:39 PM)childeye Wrote:  I'll say this. It's like watching Mozart have to listen to a lesson on the intricacies of the kazoo.

Oh I see. So you actually think your equivocating garbage is somehow equal to "Mozart" and those that disagree with you are "kazoo players".

Perhaps the "foundational lie" is pride, just like yours. Drinking Beverage
Yes, believing the foundational lie is a source of pride. You got that much right.

Actually, I think a lot of Revenant. I therefore expected more than the same old boring history lesson.
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18-07-2014, 08:55 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 05:34 PM)childeye Wrote:  ...
I believe there is a lie upon which all other lies are built. A false premise that dwells in the subconscious. And it is the foundation of deception which harbors every spirit that is darkness in the souls of mankind. I have brought the subject to this forum in hopes, the able minds of skeptical thought can uncover it. Despite the simple format that I have presented, I have yet to see any worthy dialogue, or even any comprehension of it's existence and the subsequent implications, all because every mind here appears to be disabled by Godphobia.

Let me see if I understood that...

a) You believe that
b) there is an incorrect proposition
c) in the part of the mind below the level of conscious perception and
d) this level is false and
e) this level contains alcohol and
f) this alcohol is dark in colour.

Did I get that right?

If true, it sounds very rum indeed.

Dodgy

a) What is your evidence for this belief?

b) and c) Perhaps I'm wrong but does not a proposition require consciousness?

d) How do you know?



This is all very confusing. Sadcryface

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18-07-2014, 09:30 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 05:34 PM)childeye Wrote:  ...
I believe there is a lie upon which all other lies are built. ...
...

Wow, what a coincidence. Dodgy

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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19-07-2014, 12:21 PM (This post was last modified: 19-07-2014 02:39 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 05:34 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-07-2014 04:17 PM)DLJ Wrote:  But I did wade through the entire thread looking for this psychic lie you mentioned... so I guess I must have been at least mildly intrigued Blush
I believe there is a lie upon which all other lies are built. A false premise that dwells in the subconscious. And it is the foundation of deception which harbors every spirit that is darkness in the souls of mankind.

"I AM." is the lie. Silly geese.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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19-07-2014, 02:53 PM (This post was last modified: 19-07-2014 03:31 PM by childeye.)
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 08:14 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(17-07-2014 10:47 PM)childeye Wrote:  Sin is a direction away from God, hence it is an action as well as a state of being. To not trust God is therefore a sin. I don't believe it was a willful sin. I don't think they saw it as distrusting God. I don't think they ever even felt distrust before. I think this was a dark feeling for Adam as he considered whether the woman was telling the truth.

Ask a Christian if Adam was sorry for what he did. And remember we're projecting here. They most likely will say yes, because he got kicked out of the garden. How many will answer yes, because he ended up counting God a self serving liar rather than trusting that God was faithful and always looking out for Adams best interests? How many will say Adam is sorry for hurting God? The subtlety of the lie is still alive in the psyche. God does not want to hear we're sorry we got kicked out of the garden. It is a false sorrow.

I have to go to bed now. I thank you for your time and rep points and I'm looking forward to your comments on my above thoughts about Adam and the foundational lie.

Quote:Again you are pushing God as victim, that is impossible for an Omnimax being. Nothing can happen that he is unaware of and cannot change or he is not Omnipotent/Omniscient.
Just because nothing can happen that He is unaware of does not mean He can't be a victim. Being taken for granted is being victimized. As parents we know our children will take us for granted which they cannot help, but yet we are victims of their ignorance.

Quote: Therefore he knew before he even began that this would happen and yet you claim he is the victim.
Yes, He knew vanity was inevitable and therefore predictable. He also therefore didn't invent it.
Quote: No my friend God is the one at fault, much like the negligent father with the toddler he placed 2 innocents, who had no concept of what would happen if they did this thing, into a position of great peril and then blamed them when his own carelessness and inattention allowed them to be harmed.

You are again laying out the same contradiction in reasoning. God would not spend energy on a wasted effort. If you saw the big picture and it ends up good and well, instead of faulting God you would give Him credit.


Quote:Of course the story of Adam and Eve disproves the concept of an all powerful all knowing God. He displays not only lack of knowledge (not knowing where they were when they hid or what they had done) but shows him to not have the power to fix it.

Okay so now you make the claim that God lacks knowledge because He called out to them and they were hiding and He didn't know where they were or what they had done. And perhaps God did not know the serpent was in the garden and up to no good. I would point out then that your claim of God being malevolent is now out the window according to Epicurus' problem of evil. However, then you claim that God cannot fix any of it, when in fact the Christ fixes everything. Moreover we see that the children of Light could not have been made apart from all the prior events. This shows all knowingness despite the way the story is told. Why did you not consider that the storyteller has inadequate language to express Eternal concepts through temporal terms. Can you do better? If not, then don't criticize.

Quote: Now we know this story was just one of many stolen from the babylonians and was written from the perspective of an Oden or Zeus all father non-omnimax god which makes it more understandable why he was unaware how stupid he was being. His reaction is still monstrous and that of an abusive person but the bits that show him to not be Omni are explained. In fact Yahweh himself was just one of a pantheon at this time the 72nd son of El in the palestinian pantheon to be exact. Yahweh, lord of hosts god of the army.
It's statements like these that make me shake my head. Everything you say here is total conjecture and is clearly biased.
Quote:What the intended message of this story is without presuppositional bs is quite simply do not think listen to what god (or more accurately the priest speaking for god) says and do what they say without thought, regardless of whether it makes sense or not. It is simply a control story used by the levites to exert control in what was a theocracy.

How you jump from the story of creation in Genesis as a means to manipulate minds through fraudulent means, is of course a leap of blind faith and not without a transparent display of suspicion. But your suspicion is unfounded precisely because the story, is of it's self, a story of how the innocent were manipulated through a fraudulent means. So maybe you should be more skeptical of your skepticism and consider how it is that you missed that.

Quote:Have you ever wondered why, if Yahweh was always poking in on Israel and Judah, did the jews keep going to other gods? The answer is simple, the levites were great at maintaining power but sucked at running a civilisation. One of the reasons they flipped from a Polytheist society to a Monotheist one was they thought that elevating their war god would bring them marshall success yet they were conquered by every major power to ever sniff at that region. So the people seeing their war god fail time and time again would wander away to other idols leaving the golden calf (the symbol of Yahweh in the northern kingdom) for greener pastures.
Your conclusion is again founded on suspicion. No doubt there is a such thing as corruption. But of course there must be something first to corrupt. You are simply attacking an ephod.
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19-07-2014, 03:04 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
(18-07-2014 08:01 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(18-07-2014 05:39 PM)childeye Wrote:  I'll say this. It's like watching Mozart have to listen to a lesson on the intricacies of the kazoo.

Quote:Oh I see. So you actually think your equivocating garbage is somehow equal to "Mozart" and those that disagree with you are "kazoo players".
What you see as equivocation is simply the occurrence of different connotations and inferences derived from the same word or phrase.
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19-07-2014, 03:07 PM
RE: The foundational lie in the psyche
"I AM." is the lie. Silly geese.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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