The god argument.
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03-01-2012, 05:00 PM
The god argument.
Ive been watching loads of interviews, debates and youtube videos lately
and ive noticed that theists base their assumption of god on 1 argument.

what created the universe, fine tuning of the universe, we came from nothing.

basically all i hear from them is, "i dunno what did it therefore god must've done it."

"Yeah, good idea. Make them buy your invisible apple. Insist that they do. Market it properly and don't stop until they pay for it." -Malleus
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03-01-2012, 05:04 PM
RE: The god argument.
(03-01-2012 05:00 PM)Jackrabbit Wrote:  Ive been watching loads of interviews, debates and youtube videos lately
and ive noticed that theists base their assumption of god on 1 argument.

what created the universe, fine tuning of the universe, we came from nothing.

basically all i hear from them is, "i dunno what did it therefore god must've done it."

Yup, that's pretty much it.

"This is all too complicated to have a natural explanation."
"We are/must be more than just animals."
etc.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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03-01-2012, 05:12 PM
RE: The god argument.
In the Beginning, Gwyneth Paltrow created Me; from I, the universe.

See how they are? Always skipping the truth so that they can rush forward into their truth. Theists... Tongue

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03-01-2012, 05:16 PM
RE: The god argument.
Yup. If you enjoy enraging/torturing yourself, just listen to one of William Lane Craig's debates.
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03-01-2012, 05:17 PM
RE: The god argument.
(03-01-2012 05:00 PM)Jackrabbit Wrote:  Ive been watching loads of interviews, debates and youtube videos lately
and ive noticed that theists base their assumption of god on 1 argument.

what created the universe, fine tuning of the universe, we came from nothing.

basically all i hear from them is, "i dunno what did it therefore god must've done it."

Not only a god but their God. You know the Caucasian one with the long gray beard.

.
I wasn't . . . until I was
I am . . . until I'm not
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03-01-2012, 05:18 PM
RE: The god argument.
(03-01-2012 05:16 PM)Ben Wrote:  Yup. If you enjoy enraging/torturing yourself, just listen to one of William Lane Craig's debates.

yeah i just wanted to wag my finger at that guys face and say "your not making any sense!"

he goes the univers had to be created therefore god did it, therefore god is jesus.

"Yeah, good idea. Make them buy your invisible apple. Insist that they do. Market it properly and don't stop until they pay for it." -Malleus
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03-01-2012, 05:18 PM
RE: The god argument.
..., AKA the cosmological argument, AKA god of the gaps, AKA the argument from ignorance.

It's fairly easy to debunk if your opponent listens to reason. But don't be fooled, this is not the reason why they believe. It's just a weapon they think they have against people like you and me. It's an attempt to rationalize what they believe irrationally.

Oh, no Hallucinations 4:11 says the 'gilded sheep should be stewed in rat blood' but Morons 5:16 contradicts it. (Chas)

I would never shake a baby unless the recipe requires it.
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03-01-2012, 10:49 PM
RE: The god argument.
Here's one for you.

I'm debating with an ordained minister in one of my philosophy classes regarding the proof of the existence of an afterlife. I'll give the guy credit for walking into the lions den unarmed (mentally). Now, I'm pretty much eating his lunch when he drops this one on me.

"If there is no after life, then how do you explain the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ from the dead after three days".

You see, all theological arguments are simply this.
"God exists, bla bla bla, therefore god exists". In his mind the resurrection is true, therefore the after life must be true as well. I'll not bore you with the rest of the debate.

"Philosophy begins where Theology ends", Richard Dawkins

Read all you can on the philosophy of religion starting with the early Greeks. "The History of Western Philosophy", by Bertrand Russel is a quick easy read (836 pages in paperback). Just kiddingTongue
There is nothing new that they are arguing. It's all a circular argument. They present the circle large enough so that most can't see the connection to the beginning. Once you learn these "patterns" you can debunk their arguments easily.

Here is the ultimate question. Guys like Dr. William Lane Craig are not stupid or uneducated. They know exactly how and what they are arguing. So why would they persist in this line of argument? Can they use philosophical debate tricks and still be true believers in what they claim to believe in? I would propose that they do not. So why pretend to believe? Are you ready for the answer? Here it is:
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Lots and lots of it.
The book "A Purpose Driven Life" by Rich Warren sold 30 million copies and is still selling.
The poor sap who desperately needs to believe that they will go some place special when the body dies is their target audience, ripe to plop down their hard earned dollar to be convenced that they are special and that Jesus loves them, even though no one else does, including their own mother.
When you're selling "get out of death free cards" there will be many buyers.
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04-01-2012, 12:18 AM
RE: The god argument.
Immortality, huh? Today, I'm calling that the meme of Horus. Last month I suggested it lurks in the Schrodinger wavefunction. Progress. Wink

Return to the source doesn't mean use circular logic; it means if I ain't writing, I'm thinking. I got one thing right drawing that dang Gwynnies eleven years ago. Since then, it's been love. The Living Word of Gwynnite; over a million words, over a hundred portraits... this is a story of creation in motion, that is a story of death in perpetuation.

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04-01-2012, 01:58 AM
RE: The god argument.
Hmph, typical argument from ignorance and personal incredulity.

Those kind of arguments always beg the question; Why must god be defined as a personal sentient entity and not an impersonal purposeless thing/force?

I don't think its even possible to define "god" without begging the question IMO.

It is the same to say "I dont know why/how X happened... It must be magic!"

"The tendency to turn human judgments into divine commands makes religion one of the most dangerous forces in the world.”
-Georgia Harkness.

"La fe es patrimonio de los pendejos. (Faith is patrimony of the dumbfucks)."
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