The importance of being remembered
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
07-05-2014, 12:56 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
Hello again, TrainWreck, how are you?

Before we go on, please let me state clear that people can idolise whoever they want. I can admire whoever I want based on whatever I want, so I don't expect other people to admire whoever I want based on whatever I want; they'll probably admire whoever they want based on whatever they want. And that is ok, I might be admiring the wrong people.

Having said that,
(07-05-2014 10:58 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(07-05-2014 10:15 AM)living thing Wrote:  Unfortunately, people in my surroundings seem more prone to idolising the "greatest" murderers.
Entertainment.
Yeah, mostly; traditional media seem dedicated to providing entertainment and spreading ideological propaganda, and I'd say their fascination with murderers stems from our fascination with reading about murderers. A story called "Jack the Ripper" probably sells much better than "Bob the Herpetologist".

But that doesn't change the fact that people tend to idolise whoever they see on television, regardless of the reasons why someone appears on television. A singer was recently tried for tax-evasion in the country where I happen to live, and even though she'd been stealing collective effort, many people waited outside the court to clap their hands and shout supportive messages on her way in and out.

Many people on this planet idolise anyone who seems famous (even those celebrities who are famous for being celebrities, without any other apparent reason) and many people on this planet compete against everyone else in order to be the greatest something. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a small set of people willing to compete against the infamous heroes of our history for the (dis)honorable position of greatest murderer. Especially if those people want to be remembered like we rememeber the infamous heroes of our history.

(07-05-2014 10:58 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(07-05-2014 10:15 AM)living thing Wrote:  If people's memorability is related to the number of documents written about them, and if internet search engines provide any sort of objective representation of the number of documents written about stuff, then the following table may be a useful indicator of relative memorability in our "modern" (i.e., primitive) societies.
I do not believe that is the accurate measuring system for the theory you define - try Obama, Mandela, and Jon Stewart.
To be fair, both bastards I mentioned died before the internet was invented; it is not surprising that there is less information about them than there is about people who are still alive or were until very recently; even Pope Francis and Oprah Winfrey are far more widely visible on the internet than the two bastards I mentioned.

But the point you seemed to miss is how the people whose contribution to humanity is none other than the fucking internet, and who are still alive, are mentioned in far fewer documents than Obama, Mandela, Jon Stewart, Pope Francis, Oprah Winfrey, the two long-dead bastards I mentioned and certain two girls that apparently did something with one cup.

You're using the internet to promote your social contract, and probably for many other things; Vinton Cerf and Bob Kahn most likely have already done more for your cause than any of the people mentioned in the last sentence of the previous paragraph. How exactly has Obama contributed to your cause? And Mandela? What about Jon Stewart?

(07-05-2014 10:58 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(07-05-2014 07:05 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  Modern society does not memorialize the perpetrators of crimes against humanity - that is why we have developed the term and process of prosecuting the perpetrators.
Do you think that quoting your own words makes them more correct?

If you ever go to London don't forget to visit the Chamber of Horrors at Madame Tussaud's wax museum. You'll see an almost lifelike reproduction of the Alpine bastard, protected from vandalism. If that is not memorialising the perpetrators of crimes against humanity, what is?

(07-05-2014 10:58 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  They [human beings out there who find in causing a massacre their ticket to stardom] are inspired by the Columbine perpetrators, but they are motivated by their frustrated desire to change society - they believe society is unfair and believe that they will shock the community to reorganize into a just community.
I don't think they're only inspired by the sad events at Columbine; I wouldn't be surprised if another source for their inspiration were that "loving" god prone to killing anything that annoys it; so much Bible-reading cannot be good for children's minds.

I've never experienced the mind of a murderer so I cannot really know what their motivations are. But sometimes they simply appear to want celebrity. In 2008, a then 16-year-old high school student was accused of plotting a shooting at his school in Mishawaka, Indiana. Apparently, an entry in the little angel's notebook read: "I wanna break the current shooting record. I wanna get instant recognition. The only thing that stops me is the fact of being put in jail forever, or having to kill myself, or getting killed by an officer. I could kill anyone without feeling sorry because society sucks!!!"

But why does society suck? Partly because people like him are willing to take other people's lives in exchange for instant recognition. If society sucks so much, kill your fucking self and only then think about killing others.

(07-05-2014 10:58 AM)TrainWreck Wrote:  Destroying all of humanity is not their goal - eliminating the irrelevant and burdensome is a ploy.
Destroying all of humanity is probably no one's goal. However, it is an accident that I see happening, with all those weapons that we are piling up. Especially when some of the people who have access to those weapons believe that by killing others in the name of their deity they will gain automatic entrance in an everlasting heaven.

Please feel free to add any opinion that you wish, but the more of your view I read, the less convinced I am about the feasibility of your social contract; you only seem to be taking into account your own subjective perspective. But if it makes you happy to think of yourself as the definitive ruler of the planet (the person who provides the rules that will govern the behaviours of people on this planet for ever) then I'm happy that you're happy.

Have fun playing god!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:12 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(07-05-2014 12:56 PM)living thing Wrote:  Please feel free to add any opinion that you wish, but the more of your view I read, the less convinced I am about the feasibility of your social contract

This inaccurate interpretation that you are describing me with is the difference in our ability to understand reality, and why I am able to generate a better social contract compared to your inability to recognize that the inadequate social contract system is the problem with society. You cannot even get that far. If you could you would be seeking the better system, and you would be eager to review what I have put forth, because there is nothing else,except the flawed systems that are in place, or decommissioned.

Humanism - ontological doctrine that posits that humans define reality
Theism - ontological doctrine that posits a supernatural entity creates and defines reality
Atheism - political doctrine opposed to theist doctrine in public policy
I am right, and you are wrong - I hope you die peacefullyCool
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:18 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(07-05-2014 01:12 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(07-05-2014 12:56 PM)living thing Wrote:  Please feel free to add any opinion that you wish, but the more of your view I read, the less convinced I am about the feasibility of your social contract

This inaccurate interpretation that you are describing me with is the difference in our ability to understand reality, and why I am able to generate a better social contract compared to your inability to recognize that the inadequate social contract system is the problem with society. You cannot even get that far. If you could you would be seeking the better system, and you would be eager to review what I have put forth, because there is nothing else,except the flawed systems that are in place, or decommissioned.

Nobody gives a fuck about your social contract in here.... go start a separate thread, genius.

You really are to stupid to notice when you're not on topic anymore, arent you?

If bullshit were music some people would be a brass band.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:23 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(07-05-2014 01:12 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  If you could you would be seeking the better system, and you would be eager to review what I have put forth, because there is nothing else
Wannabe god requesting for believers. Sad.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:27 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(06-05-2014 02:05 PM)TrainWreck Wrote:  
(06-05-2014 01:28 PM)living thing Wrote:  Please tell me about clause "250. Institution of Trust". How do you plan to institute trust? Through "security escorts"?
The state attorney generals are the legislative body in control of the federal treasury and Department of the Interior

*states' attorneys general Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:38 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(07-05-2014 01:27 PM)Chas Wrote:  *states' attorneys general Drinking Beverage

Good one - you must be proud.

Humanism - ontological doctrine that posits that humans define reality
Theism - ontological doctrine that posits a supernatural entity creates and defines reality
Atheism - political doctrine opposed to theist doctrine in public policy
I am right, and you are wrong - I hope you die peacefullyCool
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:53 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
Well, in tune with the actual topic of this thread, it seems like it is very important to trainwreck that he be remembered...

[Image: dobie.png]

Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
07-05-2014, 01:58 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
(07-05-2014 01:53 PM)Dom Wrote:  Well, in tune with the actual topic of this thread, it seems like it is very important to trainwreck that he be remembered...

Who Huh

If bullshit were music some people would be a brass band.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like War Horse's post
09-05-2014, 05:31 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
Even the greatest men of the days of old will not exist in remembrance 1,000 years from now, or, rather, very few of them will (Einstein may be apart of human history for the entirety of it for his monumental contributions).
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
09-05-2014, 07:05 PM
RE: The importance of being remembered
Hello UndercoverAtheist, how are you? And why the need to be undercover, anyway?

(09-05-2014 05:31 PM)UndercoverAtheist Wrote:  Even the greatest men of the days of old will not exist in remembrance 1,000 years from now,
Do you think so? The name and achievements of Imhotep are remembered well over four millennia after his lifetime, but you think he'll probably be forgotten within the next millennium (presuming that there are human beings 1,000 years from now) despite the fact that we now have the best methods for storing information we've ever known?

Well, maybe.

(09-05-2014 05:31 PM)UndercoverAtheist Wrote:  or, rather, very few of them will (Einstein may be apart of human history for the entirety of it for his monumental contributions).
I'm almost sure you mean "a part of human history", not apart, but nevertheless who knows? The same could have been said of Newton in the nineteenth century, and then Einstein came. What makes you think that the contributions of scientists living two hundred years from now will not be as monumental as Einstein's?

I can only say with a high degree of confidence that Einstein will be remembered throughout my lifetime. But after I finish living, I will never know.

Thanks for sharing your view. Have a good one!

(Edit: added missing word)
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: