The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
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12-12-2011, 07:09 PM (This post was last modified: 12-12-2011 07:27 PM by Buddy Christ.)
The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
I've seen some of these examples on other threads and I mentioned some at the end of my critique thread, but I'm going to compile them all into one pretty pile.

First off, I'll present the examples we've heard of given by google before adding my own.

From the site mentioned before:



Angel Depictions

-Some types of angels in the Bible do have wings, like cherubim and seraphim, though it doesn't say "two white fluffy wings and the face of a innocent unisex baby." Here is a breakdown of the biblical angelic descriptions:

The majority of angels, plus Archangel Michael and Gabriel, are ordinary looking men with no wings. They are attractive enough that mobs of people want to have sex with them, but other than that there are no distinguishing characteristics.

[This is where I'd post a picture of an angel without wings, but it virtually impossible to find one. People just need the 2 wings to recognize that this person is an angel. And if you google "angel without wings" you mostly get a bunch of emo lyrics.]


Seraphim

-Seraphim are angels that have 6 wings, two that cover their face, two that cover their feet, and two for flying. They look like this:

[Image: red%20seraphim.jpg]


Cherubim

-I have no idea why Cherubs are always depicted as babies. The Bible describes them as having four wings and four faces; man, lion, ox, and eagle.

[Image: COVER2A.gif]


Lucifer

-Lucifer is an angel and is depicted as both a man and a dragon.

Which leads me to my next piece...



Satan as a rebel angel / landlord of hell / red demon with horns thing

-Satan makes an appearance in two main instances to my recollection. First, hanging out with God as an angel and the two of them torturing the shit out of Job. Second, as a great serpent dragon battling Michael in Revelation. It doesn't say anywhere that Lucifer was cast out of heaven for rebelling and trying to overthrow God or anything like that. And it also doesn't say that Lucifer was put in charge of hell and dedicates his existence to making you sin so he can claim your soul.

Here is what Christian's claim is the mention of Satan.

In Ezekiel, God says,

28:12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
28:17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.


Christians use the "you have been in Eden" and "anointed cherub" parts and claim that this is Satan, being cast out for thinking too highly of himself. But here's my problem with this.

1. God never identified the snake in Eden as Lucifer. He banishes the snake to crawl on his belly forever... and then later Lucifer hangs out with God several times as a normal angel.

2. This part of Ezekiel is specifically damning all the human kings and rulers who have gotten too full of themselves. Here's the other passages before and after that bit:

"25:2 Son of man, set thy face against the Ammonites, and prophesy against them;
25:11 And I will execute judgments upon Moab;
29:2 Son of man, set thy face against Pharaoh king of Egypt, and prophesy against him, and against all Egypt:
30:4 And the sword shall come upon Egypt, and great pain shall be in Ethiopia,

He's just telling mankind to hate each kingdom. And the biggest tipoff that "king of tyrus" isn't synonymous for "Satan" is...

3. God literally mentions the kingdom of Tyrus.

27:2 Now, thou son of man, take up a lamentation for Tyrus;
27:3 And say unto Tyrus,
28:2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus,
28:12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus,

and then follows each kingdom damnation with a run of jibberish that could also be interpreted any way you want.


And as far as the Ruler of Hell thing, it just doesn't exist. In Revelation, Satan is first cast into the bottomless pit for a while, then thrown into a lake of fire. It doesn't say anything about him surviving the fire and collecting souls to burn with him. The story of Satan and hell is a scare tactic used to frighten children into believing.



The Holy Grail

-The Grail story originated from a King Arthur tale, which was then retold by various poets until the Holy Bowl became the Holy Serving Platter became a Holy Cup.



The Antichrist

-The Bible describes the Antichrist as being "anyone who doesn't believe Jesus is the son of God." So all atheists are the Antichrist.



There. Now that I've mentioned the ones that have already been posted, let's move on to some other ones.



Holy Water

-People are baptized in water and people who sin are always referred to as "unclean," but as far as someone placing a blessing on water, then using it to cross themselves, or sprinkling it on yourself when you enter church, or battling vampires, or warding off witches, or ordering a vial of holy water from an evangelist for only 19.95 ...nada.



The stories of the various Saints

-Similar to the gods of mythology, backgrounds and stories for the Saints of Catholicism just kind of appeared and grew until they had their own sitcoms.

For instance, the Archangel Michael is only mentioned a few times in the Bible, and is mainly used as an extension of God's sword arm, leading armies, doing battle, etc. But over the years, apparently St Michael has appeared several times with heroic deeds. He stopped pagans from flooding the sanctuary of St Michael by splitting the stream into two. He also appeared to Constantine and to troops at Normandy.



...great, I went lifting and went to Subway and now I've forgotten the rest.

Anyone else got more?

I thought of another thing I'm going to mention in the spirit of "Inconsistent with the teachings of the Bible."


The clothing selection of priests and the Pope

-Again I'm just going off the top of my head, so I may be wrong, but where in the Bible does God or Jesus instruct his apostles or prophets to dress in giant hats and shiny, colorful robes? Or tell priests to dress in black with a white collar peeking out?

The closest I can find is Leviticus:

"And he that is the high priest among his brethren, upon whose head the anointing oil was poured, and that is consecrated to put on the garments, shall not uncover his head, nor rend his clothes;"

But that is just saying that priests shouldn't tear their clothes or uncover their heads (which all priests seem to have ignored). It doesn't say that if you are a priest, wear this thing. I think the Pope is hoping his hat will act as an antenna for God. Or perhaps that's where he hides all the priestly evidence.

Following the examples set by Jesus, all priests should wear simple, almost poor clothes, since they're supposed to give all their money away anyways.

Off to bowling. Peace be with you, godless dickheads.

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12-12-2011, 07:39 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
Brilliant. You never fail to disappoint, BC. Welcome back, as well. Smile

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12-12-2011, 08:03 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
Interesting list.

Re some of the Satan stuff - I just watched a documentary on this. A lot is borrowed from Zoroastrianism. Some also comes from apocryphal books such as Enoch. But much of the modern interpretations of various spiritual beings come from Dante's Inferno, Milton's Paradise Lost, and from artworks.

What I find most interestingly absent in the bible are some of the foundational doctrines of Christianity:

Jesus as god... not in the bible.

The Trinity - god is one yet also 3 distinct persons: Father, Son, Holy Spirit... not in the bible.

The core Protestant doctrine of Sola Scriptura (that the bible is the ONLY source of divine revelation)... not in the bible. It's actually a self defeating doctrine because you need an outside authority to tell you both what books belong in the bible, and that the bible has authority.

Also absent from the bible are answers to what you might think would be important moral questions:
Abortion? Not in the bible.
Masturbation? Not in the bible.
Gender equality? Nope. But you will find misogyny.
Race equality? Nope. But will you find divine endorsements of racism aplenty.
Abolition of slavery? Nope. Slavery is condoned.
Drug use? I'm actually not sure... but I know it doesn't say Thou shalt not smoke pot.
Free speech? Certainly not!

But, god did see fit to make sure very minor and seemingly irrelevant things were recorded in minute detail.

Peace!
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12-12-2011, 08:07 PM (This post was last modified: 12-12-2011 08:15 PM by Erxomai.)
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
Not saying that you're wrong about the way Christians view Satan, but I'd like to hear your analysis of this passage:

Quote:Isaiah 14:12-15, "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."

PS...It might or might not be important to note that the word "satan" means "adversary", "accuser" or "enemy." Christians were not the ones to "invent" Satan, nor to make the connection between Satan and the talking snake. You need to take a look at the Jewish Talumd and Midrash to find the way the Jews understood that connection. I'd look it up for you, but frankly, I've been doing way more Bible Study in the past month than I have in the past 8 years combined, and it freaks me out a little. Smile

PPS...Job is reportedly the first book in the Bible to be written, so that's why you find that little chronological problem of Satan appearing "later." Job is a separate book and is meant to be taken as Wisdom literature (such as the Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Lamentations). Again, looking to the Jews, since they are responsible for what is and what is not in the Old Testament, the rabbis don't teach from the Book of Job as history, but as poetic wisdom literature.

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12-12-2011, 09:36 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
(12-12-2011 07:39 PM)Alaskan Atheist Wrote:  Brilliant. You never fail to disappoint, BC. Welcome back, as well. Smile

+1

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12-12-2011, 10:02 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
Apparently I'm not the only Cracked.com reader here. Cool

The bible also doesn't contain the phrase "God helps those who help themselves", nor have I ever read a phrase that says this in other words (although individual interpretation may vary).

The bible doesn't tell the story of Enoch going to heaven without dying. There's merely a phrase ("he walked with God") that some read too far into, but the story of Enoch is actually told in a book that isn't part of the bible, yet somehow nearly all bible-literate Christians know about Enoch's end. Why don't we have the written works of a man considered so perfect that he didn't die? I dunno. How does any book get chosen for the bible?

Finally, Satan did not tempt Eve into eating the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He is described only as "the serpent" and his punishment includes
"Cursed are you above all livestock
and all wild animals!
You will crawl on your belly
and you will eat dust
all the days of your life"
...none of which would apply to Satan (especially crawling on his belly forever). Nor does the bible mention what the fruit is, though most people picture an apple.

Ricky Gervais does a great bit on Genesis, and makes fun of this punishment part rather nicely.

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13-12-2011, 10:36 AM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
(12-12-2011 08:03 PM)Apostate XP Wrote:  Masturbation? Not in the bible.

The following might be interpreted as anti-masturbation.
Genesis 38:9-10
But Onan knew that the offspring would not be his. So whenever he went in to his brother's wife he would waste the semen on the ground, so as not to give offspring to his brother. And what he did was wicked in the sight of the Lord, and he put him to death also.

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13-12-2011, 11:38 AM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
(13-12-2011 10:36 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-12-2011 08:03 PM)Apostate XP Wrote:  Masturbation? Not in the bible.

The following might be interpreted as anti-masturbation.
Genesis 38:9-10
But Onan knew that the offspring would not be his. So whenever he went in to his brother's wife he would waste the semen on the ground, so as not to give offspring to his brother. And what he did was wicked in the sight of the Lord, and he put him to death also.

I've already addressed this somewhere else. Protestants do not believe Onanism has anything to do with masturbation (...unless Apostate can show me where they did. Probably should say, "modern" protestants). His "sin" was that he pulled out before ejaculation so he wouldn't get his brother's widow preggers. It's still a stupid story, but it hasn't anything to do with the topic of masturbation. He was "commanded" to impregnate his dead brother's wife because in the ancient Hebrew mind, this was immortality...having your progeny carry on your name and inherit your land. Onan wanted his own sons and his own lands and didn't want to plant his seed in his sister-in-law. And if you've seen my sister-in-law, I sure don't blame him one bit! So YHWH kills him because he disobeyed, not because he was fappin' off in the outhouse.

PS...Oh, but Catholics certainly have used the passage to tell little boys they'll die if they jerk off.

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13-12-2011, 12:04 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
(13-12-2011 11:38 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  PS...Oh, but Catholics certainly have used the passage to tell little boys they'll die if they jerk off.

That's a sin little Billy. But if I do it for you it's all good.

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13-12-2011, 01:39 PM
RE: The official "Things That Aren't in the Bible" thread
(12-12-2011 08:03 PM)Apostate XP Wrote:  What I find most interestingly absent in the bible are some of the foundational doctrines of Christianity:

Jesus as god... not in the bible.

I don't know about that. Half the time he refers to himself as the son of God and the other half he calls himself God.

"I and my Father are one."
"God was made manifest in the flesh."
"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."


Quote:The Trinity - god is one yet also 3 distinct persons: Father, Son, Holy Spirit... not in the bible.

Yeah I think the Trinity explanations are an attempt to make the ridiculousness of the Bible explainable. "So is Jesus God?" "Yes and no." "What?"




(12-12-2011 08:07 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  PS...It might or might not be important to note that the word "satan" means "adversary", "accuser" or "enemy." Christians were not the ones to "invent" Satan, nor to make the connection between Satan and the talking snake. You need to take a look at the Jewish Talumd and Midrash to find the way the Jews understood that connection. I'd look it up for you, but frankly, I've been doing way more Bible Study in the past month than I have in the past 8 years combined, and it freaks me out a little. Smile

Well Satan is Lucifer... and Lucifer is a Judeo-Christian character. And what it says in the Talmud is irrelevant, since anything other than the scriptures would be the work of man. We're trying to figure out what God tells us about Lucifer, not what man decided on later.


Quote:PPS...Job is reportedly the first book in the Bible to be written, so that's why you find that little chronological problem of Satan appearing "later." Job is a separate book and is meant to be taken as Wisdom literature (such as the Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Lamentations). Again, looking to the Jews, since they are responsible for what is and what is not in the Old Testament, the rabbis don't teach from the Book of Job as history, but as poetic wisdom literature.

It doesn't matter if Job is the first book, since the snake in the garden is the "creation story," everything else would logically have to occur after those events.

And I didn't say anything about blaming Christians... the Bible is the Bible. Half Jewish, half Christian. But supposedly 100% God inspired. And we're trying to discover the incongruities between what God said and what man does.

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