The sin nature of man
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24-11-2015, 01:39 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
Fatbaldthobbit
The fact that you stoop to word play shows the weakness of your position.
Alla
You can say this, but you know that what I said is true: you don't know how God's voice sounded when He said this.

Fatbaldhobbit
To the woman also he said: I will multiply thy sorrows, and thy conceptions: in sorrow shalt thou bring forth children, and thou shalt be under thy husband's power, and he shall have dominion over thee.
That sounds like anger. That sounds like punishment.
Alla
If a coach wants his team to progress, coach may say: "team, today I will make you sweat a lot, today is not going to be as fun and as easy as it was before. Today I will make you work triple.
It may sound angry to me when I read it and when I have no idea why that coach wants them to sweat and to work harder and not to have fun anymore.

English is my second language.
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24-11-2015, 01:44 PM (This post was last modified: 24-11-2015 01:50 PM by Alla.)
RE: The sin nature of man
Fatbaldhobbit
And to Adam he said: ...cursed is the earth in thy work: with labour and toil shalt thou eat thereof all the days of thy life. Thorns and thistles shall it bring forth to thee, and thou shalt eat the herbs of the earth. In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread till thou return to the earth out of which thou wast taken: for dust thou art, and into dust thou shalt return

Show me a definition of "cursed" that is not a punishment.

Alla
Did you notice what was cursed? It was the earth, not Adam. Adam(as a team in my example) was put in new conditions. In conditions where he can learn new things and to progress.

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24-11-2015, 01:48 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
Fatbaldhobbit
In our society, it is customary for parents to send their children out into the world, away from their sheltered home. When they do so, the parents usually try to prepare the child for adult life, prepare them for the joys and sorrows they will face in the "real" world.
Alla
Yes, yes. Before God sends us here He prepares us. We live with God before we come here. There are many years of preparations. millions of years? billions of years?

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24-11-2015, 01:49 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
Sin: n., Inexpedience.

--Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Don't let those gnomes and their illusions get you down. They're just gnomes and illusions.

--Jake the Dog, Adventure Time

Alouette, je te plumerai.
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24-11-2015, 02:02 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
TOC
OK, so the fruit was tainted with what exactly? Knowledge? Knowledge of right and wrong?
Alla
I have no idea. God didn't reveal. But whatever the fruit was tainted with it made Adam mortal man. Before Adam was immortal, he didn't have blood. Gods (immortal beings) don't have blood.
As soon as Adam partook that fruit he had blood in his veins. That fruit caused some kind of reaction in Adam's body, that whatever was in Adam's veins it became blood.
Mortal men are called fallen men. As soon as Adam became fallen man something happened in his brain - he could remember what he forgot when he was placed into the garden of Eden. He forgot everything he new in pre-mortal life.

TOC
So how did this tainted fruit overcome the nature of the soul that god himself gave them? Are you seriously suggesting that this tainted fruit could do something that god couldn't undo? Who planted the tree in the first place and made the fruit tainted to begin with? This goes nowhere to explain how sin nature is passed from parent to child which was the entire point of the post.[/quote]
Alla
There is no such thing as sin nature of men. God planted that tree so Adam and Eve would partake of it.

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24-11-2015, 02:08 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
(24-11-2015 01:25 PM)Alla Wrote:  The Organic Chemist
How the hell do you know what I was thinking it for? Quite presumptuous and pompous of you to even think highly of yourself enough to assume the possibility that you can know what the motive was. If you must know, it was a genuine question.
Alla
Fair enough. Could you please tell me why you want to have the answer if you don't believe that Adam and Eve even existed.

Oh, I have one genuine question: how does Santa's reindeers fly? I really can't understand this. I really want to have an answer.

Nice strawman. I never was arguing the existence of Santa or flying deer.
You demonstrate that you can't understand much at all and your analogy shows it. You think they (Adam, et.al.) were real, very few (if any) adults think Santa exists. There is no point in answering such a silly question. My thinking A&E did or didn't exist has absolutely no bearing on whether they really did or didn't. You don't seem to understand that. You think they did in some way and therefore if one is to keep an open mind, it is incumbent to try to ascertain all positions, especially the ones you don't agree with. Again, I am not surprised you don't seem to get this. By thinking about questions like this, that is how one goes about checking themselves to make certain that they believe as many true things and as few false things as possible. I sincerely doubt you have done this since you have been on this forum. I consider the possibility that I am wrong and therefore I constantly reevaluate my position. You do not. That is why no one takes you seriously. You demonstrate time and time again that you don't care about what is actually true (whether you are correct or not) and make no attempt to re-examine your position. You have poor epistemological abilities and you demonstrate this every single time you say crap like this.

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
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24-11-2015, 02:13 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
THe Organic Chemist
Could you please tell me why you want to have the answer if you don't believe that Adam and Eve even existed?

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24-11-2015, 02:17 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
(24-11-2015 01:25 PM)Alla Wrote:  Oh, I have one genuine question: how does Santa's reindeers fly? I really can't understand this. I really want to have an answer.

Why do you want to know? You know perfectly well that Santa Claus is a myth, so there is no factual answer.

Why do you continue to demonstrate such pig-headedness?

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-11-2015, 02:18 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
(24-11-2015 02:02 PM)Alla Wrote:  TOC
OK, so the fruit was tainted with what exactly? Knowledge? Knowledge of right and wrong?
Alla
I have no idea. God didn't reveal. But whatever the fruit was tainted with it made Adam mortal man. Before Adam was immortal, he didn't have blood. Gods (immortal beings) don't have blood.
As soon as Adam partook that fruit he had blood in his veins. That fruit caused some kind of reaction in Adam's body, that whatever was in Adam's veins it became blood.
Mortal men are called fallen men. As soon as Adam became fallen man something happened in his brain - he could remember what he forgot when he was placed into the garden of Eden. He forgot everything he new in pre-mortal life.

Wow. Just wow. On one breath you say that you don't know what the fruit was tainted with then on the next you totally make some shit up. Citation please for where it says that Adam had no blood. Citation please for the part about forgetting he knew in pre-mortal life.

(24-11-2015 02:02 PM)Alla Wrote:  TOC
So how did this tainted fruit overcome the nature of the soul that god himself gave them? Are you seriously suggesting that this tainted fruit could do something that god couldn't undo? Who planted the tree in the first place and made the fruit tainted to begin with? This goes nowhere to explain how sin nature is passed from parent to child which was the entire point of the post.
Alla
There is no such thing as sin nature of men. God planted that tree so Adam and Eve would partake of it.

So you are acknowledging that god put the tree there knowing full well what was going to happen and the result of it? That is akin to putting a delicious cookie in the middle of the floor, my 5 year old then coerces my 3 year-old son into eating it and then I kick my 3 YO out of the house and banishing even his children from my house. That is behavior that most normal humans would find repulsive. The god you speak of is a monster and I am glad that there is no evidence that suggests he exists. I also know that no christian that I know would agree with your assertion, including pastors. So who is correct and how do we determine it?

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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24-11-2015, 02:21 PM
RE: The sin nature of man
(24-11-2015 02:13 PM)Alla Wrote:  THe Organic Chemist
Could you please tell me why you want to have the answer if you don't believe that Adam and Eve even existed?

That is already answered right there... you're showing an awful lot of really bad reading again. Like the whole, You don't know what god "sounded like"... waht? what makes you even think that is relevant to the phrases said? You really just leap to things don't you? Do you just struggle to grasp the concept of inflection, voice, tone, and nature of these elements within writing? Is it an issue of language? There is SO MANY ways you can in just as honest nature, take things, yet you boil it down to the sum of the simplistic manner.

The question is asked because people, including YOU, believe it... nobody gives a crap about childish analogies or responses of such nature.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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