The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
06-09-2015, 11:37 AM
The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
So I know many of us have heard this excuse when discussing religion with a religious person. We say we need evidence or that we can't believe it unless we see it. But I thought about something with this argument. Yes we can't see air but we can feel it against our skin. We are able to use one of our 5 senses to detect what we qualify as air. So this rebuttal is flawed and illogical.

Now most would then go to the ever so popular " I feel him in my heart, he spoke to me" routine and give you a clear example usually involving some awaking from doing bad things or he saved them in some way by telling them what to do. What I question is do they actually hear anything? Do they know how the human body functions in regard to hearing? Because in order to hear something it must be done by our ears. Now what they "heard" was their own thoughts in their head in some cases others there was a good logical reason to explain what was heard(something in the distance, etc.) so again flawed.

Anyway I was just thinking of this last night thought I'd put it out there for discussion. Thanks
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-09-2015, 11:58 AM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
"Feel it in their heart"... hmmm, I guess you could say they have a.......sixth sense Cool

[Image: i-see-dead-people-228x256.jpg]

If we came from dust, then why is there still dust?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes cactus's post
06-09-2015, 11:59 AM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
(06-09-2015 11:37 AM)MrKrispy601 Wrote:  So I know many of us have heard this excuse when discussing religion with a religious person. We say we need evidence or that we can't believe it unless we see it. But I thought about something with this argument. Yes we can't see air but we can feel it against our skin. We are able to use one of our 5 senses to detect what we qualify as air. So this rebuttal is flawed and illogical.

Yes. It's a pointless equivocation between a colloquial, casual use of the phrase "see it" and the literal. Nothing but pointless word games.

This is something of a running theme with arguments like that.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Unbeliever's post
06-09-2015, 12:00 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
What makes these people so special that god picked them to speak to and not the millions of other believers?
Why is it when god has good news, it uses the least efficient method possible to spread the word. When god has bad news, it just floods the whole planet.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like pablo's post
06-09-2015, 12:02 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
(06-09-2015 11:37 AM)MrKrispy601 Wrote:  So I know many of us have heard this excuse when discussing religion with a religious person. We say we need evidence or that we can't believe it unless we see it. But I thought about something with this argument. Yes we can't see air but we can feel it against our skin. We are able to use one of our 5 senses to detect what we qualify as air. So this rebuttal is flawed and illogical.

Now most would then go to the ever so popular " I feel him in my heart, he spoke to me" routine and give you a clear example usually involving some awaking from doing bad things or he saved them in some way by telling them what to do. What I question is do they actually hear anything? Do they know how the human body functions in regard to hearing? Because in order to hear something it must be done by our ears. Now what they "heard" was their own thoughts in their head in some cases others there was a good logical reason to explain what was heard(something in the distance, etc.) so again flawed.

Anyway I was just thinking of this last night thought I'd put it out there for discussion. Thanks

The problem with the "I feel him in my heart, he spoke to me" as evidence of god, Hindu's have the same experience, so do other religious believers.

Oliver Sacks, the neurologist and atheist, talks about hallucinations, including auditory hallucinations in this video.





Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like dancefortwo's post
06-09-2015, 12:10 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
I remember being told about air and how we only see the effects of it, like with the trees blowing etc.

Now I would respond that you can prove the existence of air by compressing it into a tank and going scuba diving, or sitting under a large bell jar and converting enough oxygen into carbon dioxide. Air can be measured using physical experiments. You can't do the same with God.

But of course you don't think about this as a child when a teacher uses the analogy of air. You just listen to what you're told and learn what you are supposed to learn. It's just a way of conditioning you before you become old enough to see through the arguments.

I remember another teacher telling us that we have faith every day, like at a pedestrian crossing we have faith that cars will stop for us. I remembered being told that later now I am an adult and only then realising just how irresponsible it was. Maybe the teacher should have been saying that we shouldn't have faith because we can't assume that the driver isn't distracted or their foot hasn't accidentally slipped off the pedal and isn't managing to stop in time.

But as long as it brainwashes the children it doesn't matter if it can be refuted at a later date. It's essentially lying for Jesus.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Mathilda's post
06-09-2015, 12:30 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
(06-09-2015 11:37 AM)MrKrispy601 Wrote:  What I question is do they actually hear anything?
Good question. The answer is unknown until you actually hear the voice of the Holy Ghost yourself. What can be better than someone's testimony? the answer: your own testimony. when you have it then you know the answer to this good question.
(06-09-2015 11:37 AM)MrKrispy601 Wrote:  Do they know how the human body functions in regard to hearing?
May be they do, may be they don't.
(06-09-2015 11:37 AM)MrKrispy601 Wrote:  Because in order to hear something it must be done by our ears. Now what they "heard" was their own thoughts in their head in some cases others there was a good logical reason to explain what was heard(something in the distance, etc.) so again flawed.
Sometimes they may hear by their ears. But how would you know this?
Sometimes they have thoughts in their heads followed by the influence of the Holy Ghost in their hearts which is not possible to explain with any language. Influence of the Holy Ghost is very convincing and always, always brings only GOOD fruits/results(evidence)
These GOOD fruits or results is good evidence of the truthfulness of the words that are spoken by the Holy Ghost.
Small still voice of the Holy Ghost always testifies of things that are true. By the fruits(evidence)we may know this.

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-09-2015, 12:49 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
Air isn't that hard to experience.

1] Take a needle-less syringe.

2] Extend piston to fill the "chamber" with air. Or seemly nothingness.

3] Cover the hole for the needle with a finger and try to press the piston all the way down.


Experience god(s):

1] Prey.

2] ???

3] Profit.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Nishi Karano Kaze's post
06-09-2015, 12:58 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
(06-09-2015 12:30 PM)Alla Wrote:  Good question. The answer is unknown until you actually hear the voice of the Holy Ghost yourself. What can be better than someone's testimony? the answer: your own testimony. when you have it then you know the answer to this good question.

Again Alla, The Holy Ghost™, whilst dwelling within my heart whispered to me that you're in a cult and don't know what you're speaking about, The Holy Ghost™ further explained that He® doesn't know who you are, never has spoken to you, or even tried to and believes you to be deeply deceived. Now that's my personal testimony, through the revelation as communucated by Him®, so now you should be convinced that everything I've spoken is completely true.

Thank you, have a nice day and shoo fly.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 6 users Like Momsurroundedbyboys's post
06-09-2015, 12:58 PM
RE: The "you cant see air but you know its there" rebuttal
(06-09-2015 12:49 PM)Nishi Karano Kaze Wrote:  Air isn't that hard to experience.

1] Take a needle-less syringe.

2] Extend piston to fill the "chamber" with air. Or seemly nothingness.

3] Cover the hole for the needle with a finger and try to press the piston all the way down.


Experience god(s):

1] Prey.

2] ???

3] Profit.
By the fruits you know that God speaks to you. God gives new knowledge that can be applied for your good. After applying this knowledge you can see results or good fruits. Then you have evidence that God's words are true.

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: