Theism and astronomy
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19-07-2016, 10:09 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 07:55 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(19-07-2016 02:25 AM)Dworkin Wrote:  So, if God created the ‘world’ for the soul purpose of giving life to humanity, why all this other stuff?

Yep. Almost like it all sorted itself out on its own. Yes

Hi,

I think this is the crux of the question for the theist. Some theists believe, not only that God created everything that there is, but that God maintains this existence in being, moment to moment.

To me, that sounds like a heavy number with all that clutter around the universe, galaxies, black holes and the like. Of course, a pragmatist might ask if God could just have created our biosphere 'lifeboat' for the purpose of giving a particular home to man, but that doesn't allow for God's omnipotence. Theists are not comfortable with anything pre-existing God's man because it challenges the omnipotence, so they tend to be quiet on the subject of a material universe.

D.
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19-07-2016, 10:59 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 09:05 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  If it's a logarithmic scale.... STILL no. Planck length is on the order of 10^-36 meters and the diameter of the universe is only around 10^27 or 10^28 meters. The "center" would be on the order of 10^-5 or 10^-4 meters, about the size of a largish dust mite. That's the observable universe, btw. The present universe (the one that might hypothetically be observable if we could see it in real time, without worrying about speed-of-light delay or inverse-square problems) may well be

Here is a little game that helps put into perspective the size of things.

http://htwins.net/scale2/

Human beings begin their existence at conception. A human zygote(the product of conception) also happens to be the size of a dust mite so it is at the center.
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19-07-2016, 11:02 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 08:48 AM)JDog554 Wrote:  
(19-07-2016 02:46 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  the earth is on the large side.

Earth is on the large side? There are planets and stars that make us looking like a spec of dust.

On the scale bounded by the smallest possible size we can know about and the largest possible size we can know about, the earth falls closer to the larger end then the smaller end.
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19-07-2016, 11:08 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 10:59 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Human beings begin their existence at conception. A human zygote(the product of conception) also happens to be the size of a dust mite so it is at the center.

You're going back to the humanocentric view of the universe.
This is not a step forward in astronomy or philosophy.

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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19-07-2016, 11:14 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 11:08 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(19-07-2016 10:59 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Human beings begin their existence at conception. A human zygote(the product of conception) also happens to be the size of a dust mite so it is at the center.

You're going back to the humanocentric view of the universe.
This is not a step forward in astronomy or philosophy.

Merely noting that on the scale bounded by the extremes of what can be known by us or by say a creature the size of Jupiter, we fall in the center is not being anthropomorphic.
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19-07-2016, 11:32 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 02:46 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  On the scale where the observable universe is at the big end, and the Planck length is at the small end, humans are right in the middle and the earth is on the large side.
..
Why do you think that is?

Planck lenght: 10^-34m
Observable universe: 10^26m (maybe 10^27, god only knows)
Middle: 10^-4m = 100µm ≠ Human: 10^0m
Earth: 10^7m

Human:
You are wrong by 4 decades, 10.000 or 10^4 , or in relation to the span of your entire logarithmic scale (60 decades): 6,7%
The correct "middle" would be someting the size of 100µm. Hair or sand has the size of 100µm.

Why do you think that is?

So the universe was made for......(human) hair? Or...fine sand?
Makes sense to me, since there are as many stars in the universe as grains of sand on every beach on earth. Think about it! Its a hint to us! Its all about sand! Hail the lord for sand! Praise him for sand! Sand is all what creation is about! Sand! Its the crowning jewel in gods creation!

On a sidenote:
Earth:
If your total span is 60 decades and 10^-34 is "small", then Earth is 41/60 or ca. 2/3 towards "large". Does that constitute "large"? Not until "large" is defined as a range on your scale (which you or the original author didnt bother to do). Maybe its the upper end of "medium"?

Smartass



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19-07-2016, 11:34 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 11:14 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(19-07-2016 11:08 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  You're going back to the humanocentric view of the universe.
This is not a step forward in astronomy or philosophy.

Merely noting that on the scale bounded by the extremes of what can be known by us or by say a creature the size of Jupiter, we fall in the center is not being anthropomorphic.

To quote Wikipedia:
Quote:There is currently no proven physical significance of the Planck length; it is, however, a topic of theoretical research.
link

Your living planet creature is pure speculation.

Your proposed scale has little to no relevance in a discussion of astronomy.

Unless of course, you can provide some reason to apply your speculation to the real, observable universe.

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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19-07-2016, 11:38 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 10:59 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Human beings begin their existence at conception. A human zygote(the product of conception) also happens to be the size of a dust mite so it is at the center.

And 99,99999% of our life we arent the size of 100µm.
And when we die we are 100% not 100µm.
I also have worked with copper wire the size of 100µm.
And my fingers are several cm, not even talking about my d*ck, which is also several decades above the middle.

So what?

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19-07-2016, 11:39 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 11:32 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  Why do you think that is?

So the universe was made for......(human) hair? Or...fine sand?
Makes sense to me, since there are as many stars in the universe as grains of sand on every beach on earth. Think about it! Its a hint to us! Its all about sand! Hail the lord for sand! Praise him for sand! Sand is all what creation is about! Sand! Its the crowning jewel in gods creation!

Nooooo. Wait, I see it now!!!

Sand is mostly silica which is a form of silicon...

Silicon is used for breast implants...

Breast implants are for... Breasts.

Everything leads back to boobs. Big Grin

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19-07-2016, 11:54 AM
RE: Theism and astronomy
(19-07-2016 10:59 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(19-07-2016 09:05 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  If it's a logarithmic scale.... STILL no. Planck length is on the order of 10^-36 meters and the diameter of the universe is only around 10^27 or 10^28 meters. The "center" would be on the order of 10^-5 or 10^-4 meters, about the size of a largish dust mite. That's the observable universe, btw. The present universe (the one that might hypothetically be observable if we could see it in real time, without worrying about speed-of-light delay or inverse-square problems) may well be

Here is a little game that helps put into perspective the size of things.

http://htwins.net/scale2/

Human beings begin their existence at conception. A human zygote(the product of conception) also happens to be the size of a dust mite so it is at the center.

If you notice on that site humans are 10^0, on the small end it is 10^-35, and on the other approximately 10^26.6
You decided to use a human ovum at 10^-3.5 becuase it suits your weird narrative.

While that may not seem like much the difference in power of 10^8.4 is the difference between a meter and a nanometer 0.000000001 or a human and the distance from Earth to the Moon...hardly the ‘middle’.

Nice try. Besides, why would we want to be in the middle anyway? What’s so special about the middle? I suppose that a few hundred years ago you would have believed in a Geocentric universe and put DaVinci in a cell. Maybe you still do, how medieval of you.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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