Things that make me crazy
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10-11-2012, 02:29 PM (This post was last modified: 10-11-2012 02:44 PM by Free.)
Things that make me crazy
Space:


What the hell is it? People keep saying- aside from planets, stars, comets etc,- space is empty of substance. Basically they say empty space is nothingness.

But how can that be? If it was nothingness, how then could there be distance between two points in space? If there was nothing in between the Earth and Mars, wouldn't Earth and Mars be touching each other?

Supposed empty space should not be considered as a void, or as nothingness. It should be classified as something that has an existence.

The Big Bang


People keep saying that everything began with a Big Bang. Well where the hell did the matter that created the Big Bang come from in the first place? From nothing? How do we get something from nothing?

Expanding Universe


What the hell is it expanding into? If there was nothing there in the first place, how the hell do you expand into nothing?


Nothingness:

Does it even exist?

Blink


Someone help me here ... before I end up in the Funny Farm.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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10-11-2012, 02:48 PM
Things that make me crazy
I'd love some good info on this as well.
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10-11-2012, 03:12 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
The universe is expanding into itself, I imagine it like the TARDIS or the tents in Harry potter, bigger on the inside. With that in mind, imagine it gets bigger and bigger inside, it's like more distance is added between things without things actually moving, it's a very counter-intuitive idea Tongue

About the other things, I can't say, there's no clear answer anywhere Sad

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10-11-2012, 03:21 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
(10-11-2012 03:12 PM)nach_in Wrote:  The universe is expanding into itself, I imagine it like the TARDIS or the tents in Harry potter, bigger on the inside. With that in mind, imagine it gets bigger and bigger inside, it's like more distance is added between things without things actually moving, it's a very counter-intuitive idea Tongue

About the other things, I can't say, there's no clear answer anywhere Sad
If the universe is expanding into itself, then from where is it expanding from?

Consider

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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10-11-2012, 03:28 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
(10-11-2012 03:21 PM)Free Wrote:  
(10-11-2012 03:12 PM)nach_in Wrote:  The universe is expanding into itself, I imagine it like the TARDIS or the tents in Harry potter, bigger on the inside. With that in mind, imagine it gets bigger and bigger inside, it's like more distance is added between things without things actually moving, it's a very counter-intuitive idea Tongue

About the other things, I can't say, there's no clear answer anywhere Sad
If the universe is expanding into itself, then from where is it expanding from?

Consider
It's not expanding "from" anywhere, it's not like a balloon that has a centre and every point in the surface gets away from it at the balloon inflates, but Lawrence Krauss explains this point much better than I, check the video around minute 7




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10-11-2012, 04:05 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
(10-11-2012 02:29 PM)Free Wrote:  Space:

What the hell is it? People keep saying- aside from planets, stars, comets etc,- space is empty of substance. Basically they say empty space is nothingness.

Actually that's not true. Empty space is NOT "nothingness". It is just space that has nothing in it. In fact it's not even nothing, it's filled with a very small amount of hydrogen and helium (maybe one or two atoms per cubic meter), and the space in-between these atoms is filled with virtual particles, that is particles that come into existence due to the laws of quantum mechanics, and immediately collide with their anti-particle, resulting in a net loss/gain of zero mass/energy. The pressure exerted by these virtual particles can actually be used to generate minute (like, almost negligible, but still there) amounts of energy.

Quote:But how can that be? If it was nothingness, how then could there be distance between two points in space? If there was nothing in between the Earth and Mars, wouldn't Earth and Mars be touching each other?

You're confusing vacuum--that is, space that has nothing in it--with "nothingness", that being the absence of anything, including space and time. They're two different things. There's a difference between an empty glass, and a glass that does not exist.

Quote:Supposed empty space should not be considered as a void, or as nothingness. It should be classified as something that has an existence.

Invalidated by the answer to the question above.

Quote:The Big Bang

People keep saying that everything began with a Big Bang. Well where the hell did the matter that created the Big Bang come from in the first place? From nothing? How do we get something from nothing?

We don't know yet. Give the physicists another 50 years, ok? This sciencey stuff is hard.

Quote:Expanding Universe

What the hell is it expanding into? If there was nothing there in the first place, how the hell do you expand into nothing?

The universe is not expanding into something. Expansion of the universe refers to the fact that objects in the universe seem to be getting farther apart. That is to say, the distance between objects is increasing but the objects aren't actually moving.


Quote:Nothingness:

Does it even exist?

Dunno.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
It works, bitches.
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10-11-2012, 05:12 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
In regard to "nothingness"; physicist Victor J. Stenger (in his book "God: The Failed Hypothesis") had this to say:

"In chapter 2 we saw how nature is capable of building complex structures by processes of self-organization, how simplicity begets complexity. Consider the example of the snowflake, the beautiful six-pointed pattern of ice crystals that results from the direct freezing of water vapor in the atmosphere. Our experience tells us that a snowflake is very ephemeral, melting quickly into drops of liquid water that exhibit far less structure. But that is only because we live in a relatively high-temperature environment, where heat reduces the fragile arrangement of crystals to a simpler liquid. Energy is required to break the symmetry of a snowflake.

In an environment where the ambient temperature is well below the melting point of ice, as it is in most of the universe far from the highly localized effects of stellar heating, any water vapor would readily crystallize into complex, asymmetric structures. Snowflakes would be eternal, or at least would remain intact until cosmic rays tore them apart.

This example illustrates that many simple systems of particles are unstable, that is, have limited lifetimes as they undergo spontaneous phase transitions to more complex structures of lower energy. Since 'nothing' is as simple as it gets, we cannot expect it to be very stable. It would likely undergo a spontaneous phase transition to something more complicated, like a universe containing matter. The transition of nothing-to-something is a natural one, not requiring any agent. As Nobel laureate physicist Frank Wilczek has put it, 'The answer to the question why is there something rather than nothing? would then be that nothing is unstable'."

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10-11-2012, 05:55 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
(10-11-2012 05:12 PM)Misanthropik Wrote:  In regard to "nothingness"; physicist Victor J. Stenger (in his book "God: The Failed Hypothesis") had this to say:

"In chapter 2 we saw how nature is capable of building complex structures by processes of self-organization, how simplicity begets complexity. Consider the example of the snowflake, the beautiful six-pointed pattern of ice crystals that results from the direct freezing of water vapor in the atmosphere. Our experience tells us that a snowflake is very ephemeral, melting quickly into drops of liquid water that exhibit far less structure. But that is only because we live in a relatively high-temperature environment, where heat reduces the fragile arrangement of crystals to a simpler liquid. Energy is required to break the symmetry of a snowflake.

In an environment where the ambient temperature is well below the melting point of ice, as it is in most of the universe far from the highly localized effects of stellar heating, any water vapor would readily crystallize into complex, asymmetric structures. Snowflakes would be eternal, or at least would remain intact until cosmic rays tore them apart.

This example illustrates that many simple systems of particles are unstable, that is, have limited lifetimes as they undergo spontaneous phase transitions to more complex structures of lower energy. Since 'nothing' is as simple as it gets, we cannot expect it to be very stable. It would likely undergo a spontaneous phase transition to something more complicated, like a universe containing matter. The transition of nothing-to-something is a natural one, not requiring any agent. As Nobel laureate physicist Frank Wilczek has put it, 'The answer to the question why is there something rather than nothing? would then be that nothing is unstable'."
Excellent article, and the video posted in a post a ways up was also awesome.

I think what I was getting at in regards to "Nothingness" can be summed up like this:

"There is no such thing as no such thing."

As contradictory and paradoxical as that sounds, I believe we are finally coming to the realization that what we considered to be "nothingness" is actually an existence of some yet unknown element alien to our periodic table. Of course I am only using an unknown element as one such possibility, but my real point is that something unknown is in existence of what appears to be nothingness.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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10-11-2012, 06:04 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
I see what you mean about it being "paradoxical". If nothing is, meaning, if it exists, then it has just become "something".

One could go crazy pondering this sort of thing. lol

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10-11-2012, 06:06 PM
RE: Things that make me crazy
Quote:
Quote:Space:

What the hell is it? People keep saying- aside from planets, stars, comets etc,- space is empty of substance. Basically they say empty space is nothingness.



Actually that's not true. Empty space is NOT "nothingness". It is just space that has nothing in it. In fact it's not even nothing, it's filled with a very small amount of hydrogen and helium (maybe one or two atoms per cubic meter), and the space in-between these atoms is filled with virtual particles, that is particles that come into existence due to the laws of quantum mechanics, and immediately collide with their anti-particle, resulting in a net loss/gain of zero mass/energy. The pressure exerted by these virtual particles can actually be used to generate minute (like, almost negligible, but still there) amounts of energy.

Agreed. Space is not a vacuum. However, since it is not a vacuum, then there can be no such thing as empty space. Hense, space is "something."



Quote:
Quote:The Big Bang

People keep saying that everything began with a Big Bang. Well where the hell did the matter that created the Big Bang come from in the first place? From nothing? How do we get something from nothing?



We don't know yet. Give the physicists another 50 years, ok? This sciencey stuff is hard.

Perhaps there's no such thing as nothing?


Quote:
Quote:Expanding Universe

What the hell is it expanding into? If there was nothing there in the first place, how the hell do you expand into nothing?



The universe is not expanding into something. Expansion of the universe refers to the fact that objects in the universe seem to be getting farther apart. That is to say, the distance between objects is increasing but the objects aren't actually moving.

Then the universe- excluding objects- is infinite in dimensions? I mean ... space is infinite?



Quote:
Quote:Nothingness:

Does it even exist?



Dunno.


If it does, then it cannot be nothingness. I think this is the biggest question in history that needs an answer.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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