Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
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04-01-2014, 02:12 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
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04-01-2014, 02:13 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
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04-01-2014, 02:18 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
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04-01-2014, 02:19 PM (This post was last modified: 04-01-2014 02:24 PM by Clara.)
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
Sorry for this mess - for any reason my post comes out empty although I wrote something of course!
Or is it just me who can't see anything?
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04-01-2014, 02:32 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
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04-01-2014, 02:52 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
Here it is...

(04-01-2014 02:18 PM)Clara Wrote:  
(04-01-2014 01:34 PM)Baruch Wrote:  Afraid of Islam being true ? So what - if it was true I would be a proud muslim !
Its not so bad, bow down 5 times a day Bowing, learn Arabic which can sound melodic and nice when chanted, go to the mosque, behave decently without being too fundamentalist and strapping bombs to your waist and you will get heaven.
Perhaps I don't have anything against this is someone enjoys this lifestyle due to enjoying much of my experience in orthodox Judaism which is similar to Islam. Too much pork isn't good for you anyway !!!

As it happens Islamic arguments by Harun Yahya or Zakir Naik have been easily refuted and there really isn't much evidence for the QUran being divine. (or the Bible)
My journey was from fundamentalist orthodox believer, to religious philosopher, to philosopher of religion to secular philosopher.

I'm afraid because I do not want to be a Muslim and I do not want to live my life like that. It would be horrible that "God" just dreated humanity to worship him and if the human doesn't obey then he tortures him for eternity! I'm sorry but this is basically the most terrible thing I can imagine. I want to have fun in my life and exactly that is more or less "forbidden" in Islam because all you are supposed to do is to worship God all day long.

Quote:Islam actually has a MUCH better theology in terms of the nature of God, His attributes and definitely would be more reasonable & logical for example by abandoning the trinity, abandoning "jesus as a god or partner to god" , not accepting jesus as a sacrifice for other peoples sins etc.
The Islamic philosophers also were easily much more skilled in trying to harmonize Islam with Greek rational Philosophy than Christians.

But Jewish theology would be more or less the same as Islamnic theology, wouldn't it? Concerning trinity, original sin etc. Would you agree? Did you actually study Islam thoroughly and then decided that it's not the truth?

Quote:For a proper answer to your question (and I'm really intrigued as to what you first question was going to be) you need to go back to the original texts in their original languages

Yeah, that already came to my mind already. I googled it but it's rather difficult to find out which exact word was used in the oldest available Genesis version which I suppose are the Dead Sea Scrolls.
I would actually be relieved to ask someone what he thinks about my first question Smile But I am really not sure that you would want that. So far everyone I confronted with it did not even take me serious.

(by the way, I am German so I hope my English is not too bad!)

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04-01-2014, 02:59 PM (This post was last modified: 04-01-2014 03:21 PM by DLJ.)
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
(04-01-2014 01:29 PM)maklelan Wrote:  ...
In other words, this quote is a marginally informed rhetorical jab at Christian fundamentalism. Not particularly helpful for the larger discussion.

I beg to differ.

I prefer:
In other words, this quote is a simplistic rhetorical jab at Christianity fundamentalism. Not particularly helpful for the larger discussion by demonstrating, in the form of ridicule, why there is not much point worrying about it or wasting time trying to find a deeper troof.

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04-01-2014, 04:11 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
So am I right if I say that you all think that this is just a coincidence and not something that was done on purpose?
Funny though, this is as much as I can remember the only topic of Harun Yahya where he didn't lie.
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04-01-2014, 04:23 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
(04-01-2014 02:59 PM)DLJ Wrote:  I beg to differ.

I prefer:
In other words, this quote is a simplistic rhetorical jab at Christianity fundamentalism. Not particularly helpful for the larger discussion by demonstrating, in the form of ridicule, why there is not much point worrying about it or wasting time trying to find a deeper troof.

Thumbsup

First, the argument has no bearing on a large portion of Christianity, so your attempt to flippantly toss the blanket of the claim over the entire Christian tradition is uninformed. Second, what you're saying is that it's naive rhetoric that's still good enough, in your mind, to get across the point that you reject that worldview, provided the other person is equally or more uninformed.

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04-01-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: Thoughts about the Bible and the Koran
Quote: Clara: I'm afraid because I do not want to be a Muslim and I do not want to live my life like that. It would be horrible that "God" just created humanity to worship him and if the human doesn't obey then he tortures him for eternity! I'm sorry but this is basically the most terrible thing I can imagine. I want to have fun in my life and exactly that is more or less "forbidden" in Islam because all you are supposed to do is to worship God all day long.

Agree. There are many reasons why it is incoherent to worship any God regardless if Allah or Jesus or Zeus.
If God is perfect and creates everything why does he need worshipping. Imagine if I created in the lab some sentient robots who are completely dependent on myself to provide them everything they need. Why would I demand their worship being so far superior to them ? Its just arrogant nonsense. This is of course not new and I'm not the first to point this out. Spinoza pointed out many reasons why a personal deity is incoherent and pointless to worship - it is after all self sufficient and does not need anything therefore DOES NOT NEED ANY PRAYER OR WORSHIP !
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