Threatening children with Hell is a crime
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17-05-2013, 12:20 PM
Threatening children with Hell is a crime
My whole journey here to this page started because I was threatened with hell during my Catholic Catechism while I lived in Spain. I was 12 or 13 I think.

I don't remember much but I do remember the threat of Hell from the priests at that Church in Madrid Spain back in the 1980s

I am proposing:

1) Suing the Catholic church for Psychological and/or emotional damage.

2) A campaign to make it a crime to threaten children with torturous, eternal, fiery Hell



please discuss or advice

Thanks
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17-05-2013, 12:30 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
While I support this 100%, it's unrealistic, so I see no point in wasting time and money on it. Spreading the truth is a long and hard work, one that can not be won fast, in a lawsuit. Think about all those pedophile priests, nobody is processing most of them, so there is just no way that a lawsuit like this would work. The Church is well protected, they need not worry about these "petty" things.

Also, one should not sue the Church, it did not force you there, but your parents did, I would rather sue them.

Smile

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17-05-2013, 12:36 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
(17-05-2013 12:20 PM)Leif Wrote:  My whole journey here to this page started because I was threatened with hell during my Catholic Catechism while I lived in Spain. I was 12 or 13 I think.

I don't remember much but I do remember the threat of Hell from the priests at that Church in Madrid Spain back in the 1980s

I am proposing:

1) Suing the Catholic church for Psychological and/or emotional damage.

2) A campaign to make it a crime to threaten children with torturous, eternal, fiery Hell



please discuss or advice

Thanks

Don't know much about Spanish law. As an American, I'm pretty much ignorant outside of my own borders. (Half sarcasm, but only half.) Two things you'd likely need are:

1) Showing fault. It's not enough to say "this person said something that haunted me for decades". You also have to show that it was in some way criminal (or a breach of contract, or something) for them to do so. Emotional suffering speaks to the existence and extent of damages you might be due for a wrong, but does not establish the wrong in the first place.

2) In the US, at least, and in many liberal democracies, talking about Hell falls under freedom of religion. The only way to make it illegal here would be to amend the Constitution. The FIRST amendment, which is both strongly protected by popular opinion and also contains a whole slew of other stuff that we really, REALLY don't want to putz around with. But again, don't know what the law looks like in Spain.

I'm not commenting on your goals, just the difficulty of achieving them.

"If I ignore the alternatives, the only option is God; I ignore them; therefore God." -- The Syllogism of Fail
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17-05-2013, 12:52 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
I might be going out on a limb here but they were not talking about hell, they were threatening me and asking me to do things that if I didn't do I would be sent to hell. i.e. Do this or you will go to Hell ! Do this other thing or you will go to hell !
Perform this action or you will go to hell !

I think this is different from merely talking about Hell !

(17-05-2013 12:36 PM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(17-05-2013 12:20 PM)Leif Wrote:  



2) In the US, at least, and in many liberal democracies, talking about Hell falls under freedom of religion. The only way to make it illegal here would be to amend the Constitution. The FIRST amendment, which is both strongly protected by popular opinion and also contains a whole slew of other stuff that we really, REALLY don't want to putz around with. But again, don't know what the law looks like in Spain.
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17-05-2013, 12:59 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
Yes, a huge problem overall:

1. It's not "do this or go to Hell" but rather, receive a free gift, there's nothing "to do", and go to Heaven, "For God so loved the people of the world that whoever trusts Jesus has eternal life"

2. Young people do not go to Hell (in my understanding of the scriptures), children are allowed without exception to Heaven

3. The attitude on this forum is not "turn the other cheek" but "sue someone" and the Bible says to honor parents, not sue them, and avoid lawsuits against Christians

Thanks for hearing me out
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17-05-2013, 01:24 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
Hey, Leif.

It aint happening. For a million reasons. But I'll focus on one.

Parents teach their kids things. That's life. The same beliefs that scarred you so much are the ones that helped your parents raise you.

Furthermore, if you set the precedent that parents are liable for teaching their children ideas that they don't like, or that you don't like, or that hatemongers with nothing better to do don't like, then you're opening up a pandora's box that will never be closed.

Anyway, even if you, or others, dislike my reasoning, the fact remains. Your lawsuit will never happen. We all know that.

I aint saying that you don't have the right to be hurt or feel hurt or whatever, but if you're looking for some kind of solution, this aint it. Sorry.

Try looking at all of this from a different angle so you can come up with a more productive course of action.

This reminds me of a parable by Daniel Quinn. To wildly paraphrase: A house was on fire. A man walked past and saw the frantic homeowner crying for help. There were buckets of liquid on the front lawn. Wanting to extinguish the fire, the man doused the flames with the liquid. Unfortunately, the liquid was gasoline and the fire got worse. But the man kept emptying the buckets on the fire. The homeowner begged him to stop, but the man refused. I have to do SOMETHING, he said.

The drive to act can be powerful. But just because you're doing something, doesn't mean that that's the thing that's gonna make things better.

Or as the Christians say, the road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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17-05-2013, 02:20 PM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
(17-05-2013 12:20 PM)Leif Wrote:  My whole journey here to this page started because I was threatened with hell during my Catholic Catechism while I lived in Spain. I was 12 or 13 I think.

I don't remember much but I do remember the threat of Hell from the priests at that Church in Madrid Spain back in the 1980s

I am proposing:

1) Suing the Catholic church for Psychological and/or emotional damage.

2) A campaign to make it a crime to threaten children with torturous, eternal, fiery Hell



please discuss or advice

Thanks
All of us brought up Catholic have had this experience. But to seek damages is futile. Threat of prison is also common in secular society. We only become what we hate when we return evil for evil. I suggest you forgive them.
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18-05-2013, 03:28 AM
RE: Threatening children with Hell is a crime
(17-05-2013 12:59 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Yes, a huge problem overall:

1. It's not "do this or go to Hell" but rather, receive a free gift, there's nothing "to do", and go to Heaven, "For God so loved the people of the world that whoever trusts Jesus has eternal life"

2. Young people do not go to Hell (in my understanding of the scriptures), children are allowed without exception to Heaven

3. The attitude on this forum is not "turn the other cheek" but "sue someone" and the Bible says to honor parents, not sue them, and avoid lawsuits against Christians

Thanks for hearing me out

"Yes, a huge problem overall:"
Caused by priests, governments and kings threatening gullible people and children with bullshit.

"For God so loved the people of the world that whoever trusts Jesus has eternal life"
More lies derived from the same book of lies, with the same aim of controlling people's behavior.

"The attitude on this forum is not "turn the other cheek" "
Your damn right there. That's for wimps.
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