Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
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02-03-2017, 12:37 PM
Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
So in the far north west of the British Isles lies an island archipelago called the Outer Hebrides or Western Isles. They are remote and stunningly beautiful islands, but the northern islands in the chain are blighted by a particular form of strict Calvinism in the shape of the Free Church of Scotland notorious for its strict observance of the Sabbath.

Because a significant number of local councillors are "Wee Frees" this sabbatarianism manifests itself in a variety of ways. Shops are routinely closed and until recently there were no ferry services to the mainland of Scotland on a Sunday. It also means that parks and public buildings are closed.

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Bear in mind that at the time of the 2001 Census, only 42% of the population of the islands identified themselves as being affiliated with the Church of Scotland, with 13% Roman Catholic and a mere 28% with other Christian churches. Many of this last group belong to the Free Church of Scotland. Nevertheless the latter is a powerful force on the island.

One community facility which remains closed on a Sunday is the indoor swimming pool in the island capital Stornoway. Local families have been pressuring the council for the pool to be open. The council refused citing financial issues so the families embarked on a fund-raising campaign to come up with the funds necessary to meet the stated shortfall of £11,000 per annum. I was happy to support this fundraising effort through the National Secular Society.

Despite this money being raised, the council refused to accept the funds and it transpires that the reasons are religious. Despite overwhelming support within the local community for the pool to be opened on a Sunday the councillors decided that their own narrow interpretation of a personal religious belief should take precedence over the wishes of local families.

What nonsense!

So..............I found myself on a christian website discussion thread on an article about the news stating my views. To be fair, many of those christians who commented on the news were supportive of the families but as usual there were a hard core of individuals to whom any criticism of religious privilege is unacceptable.

The article on the christian website stated, "Regarding the swimming pool, one councillor was quoted as saying: "Before my election, my personal leaflet distributed to the electorate stated a commitment to uphold Christian values 'if elected' and I believe the fourth commandment, "Remembering the Sabbath day, to keep it holy" is one such value." "

The article also made it clear that Sabbatarianism is the observance of the Biblical command in Exodus 20 to keep the Sabbath 'holy'.

"Perfect", I thought.

So I made the point that Exodus also states that a child who hits or curses his parents must be executed and provides specific instructions about beating your slaves. I also stated that if the local councillor believes in such "Christian values" then he (and those values) have no place in a modern society and the imposition of those values on those who do not share them is clearly wrong. If he (and any other Christians) choose to cherry-pick bits of the bible to support an indefensible moral position then that speaks volumes about them.

So this is when the loonies come out of their dark places. Here are some examples of the nonsense that they spouted.

What harsh wilfull ignorance. Christ came to fulfill the law, not to extinguish it, but it does have the effect that many ritual practices and practical laws are forgiven Christians. Those about homosexuality are upheld in the New Testament, none of whose guidance ceases to apply, however Francis may twist it. What is indefensible is the destination of Hell offered by atheists.

I thanked him for reminding us of the homophobia. Then wondered quite why he imagined that the beliefs of middle eastern Bronze Age nomadic goat-herders should prohibit the use of a public swimming pool in modern Stornoway on a particular day of the week. I also thanked him for that parting shot about hell and that such remarks are always guaranteed to raise a smile on my part.

No response from him but then another one piped up.

"Eventually it won't raise a smile - not on YOUR face anyway."

This was followed up by similar comments from him.

I pointed out that this was a discussion about a swimming pool in Stornoway . Continued threats of hellfire and damnation from him were neither relevant or effective. I asked him to refrain from trying to intimidate. It doesn't work.

But it continued in similar vein. Others joined in too. Not a single one actually addressed the issue which was one of the imposition of religious beliefs by elected public servants on the wider community. Every single one ranted that I would go to hell, that I would suffer eternal damnation or asked "Where are you going when you die?"

Utterly utterly pathetic.

You really do know you've won the argument when these numbskulls start condemning you to the everlasting fires.

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The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike
Excreta Tauri Sapientam Fulgeat (The excrement of the bull causes wisdom to flee)
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02-03-2017, 12:44 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
That type of thought is shared throughout the world unfortunately. Good thing I don't believe in hell so I'm not burdened by that.

I get to decide what my life looks like, not the other way around.
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02-03-2017, 02:13 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
(02-03-2017 12:37 PM)Silly Deity Wrote:  So in the far north west of the British Isles lies an island archipelago called the Outer Hebrides or Western Isles. They are remote and stunningly beautiful islands, but the northern islands in the chain are blighted by a particular form of strict Calvinism in the shape of the Free Church of Scotland notorious for its strict observance of the Sabbath.

Just be happy you don't live in Saudi Arabia.
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03-03-2017, 10:04 AM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
It is typical of the mindset of the 'righteous' that it is not enough to deny themselves access to facilities once a week, they have to forbid everyone else from following their own preferences. It is almost ironic that the Free Church prevents free actions for non-members.

At least there is the opportunity to vote some of them out on May 4.
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03-03-2017, 12:43 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
Unbelievable. How does opening a pool violate the sabbath anyway? (rhetorical)

Also, they lied. It wasn't a money shortage that held them back, but religion. Why didn't they just say so in the first place? (rhetorical again)

(02-03-2017 12:37 PM)Silly Deity Wrote:  The article on the christian website stated, "Regarding the swimming pool, one councillor was quoted as saying: "Before my election, my personal leaflet distributed to the electorate stated a commitment to uphold Christian values 'if elected' and I believe the fourth commandment, "Remembering the Sabbath day, to keep it holy" is one such value." "
Fourth commandment, huh... then they should want the pool closed on Saturdays...

(02-03-2017 12:37 PM)Silly Deity Wrote:  What is indefensible is the destination of Hell offered by atheists.
I'm still trying to understand this one. Atheists offer hell? So this moron thinks atheists are sending people to hell? What? Blink

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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03-03-2017, 01:10 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
I'd be more afraid if they threatened me with being condemned to Akron Ohio for a month.......

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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03-03-2017, 01:16 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
(03-03-2017 12:43 PM)Impulse Wrote:  I'm still trying to understand this one. Atheists offer hell? So this moron thinks atheists are sending people to hell? What? Blink
I'm guessing what it means it that when them evil atheists lead a soul away from the path of righteousness, they are technically sending it straight to Hell. Or some such convoluted "logic".

I will never claim I'm a very good person (or at all, really), but even I, when I was religious, took no pleasure in the thought of others going to Hell (after a while I rejected the idea of Hell entirely. The idea of god followed (not so) shortly after). Actually, I would resort to all sorts of mental gymnastics that would result in people I loved (and later on, good people in general) ending up in Heaven.

The vile hateful individuals who end their tantrums with "you'll see I'm right when you're dead, hahaha" and not just vile and hateful, but painfully insecure, which is why they're doing their damnedest best (which isn't a lot) to persuade others to agree with them, as if even if the whole world shared their delusion, it would somehow make it true. It's pathetic, really.

Hell was one of the major contributing factors behind my deconversion, actually. I've posted this before and of course most people here have read it anyway, but truer, more compassionate (and passionate) words have rarely been spoken Heart

“Is it necessary that Heaven should borrow its light from the glare of Hell?

Infinite punishment is infinite cruelty, endless injustice, immortal meanness. To worship an eternal gaoler hardens, debases, and pollutes even the vilest soul. While there is one sad and breaking heart in the universe, no good being can be perfectly happy.

Against the heartlessness of the Christian religion every grand and tender soul should enter solemn protest. The God of Hell should be held in loathing, contempt and scorn. A God who threatens eternal pain should be hated, not loved – cursed, not worshiped. A heaven presided over by such a God must be below the lowest hell. I want no part in any heaven in which the saved, the ransomed and redeemed will drown with shouts of joy the cries and sobs of hell – in which happiness will forget misery, where the tears of the lost only increase laughter and double bliss.

The idea of hell was born of ignorance, brutality, fear cowardice, and revenge. This idea testifies that our remote ancestors were the lowest beasts. Only from dens, lairs, and caves, only from mouths filled with cruel fangs, only from hearts of fear and hatred, only from the conscience of hunger and lust, only from the lowest and most debased could come this cruel, heartless and bestial of all dogmas.

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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03-03-2017, 01:18 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
Fuck it to hell! Double post! Censored

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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03-03-2017, 01:29 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
(03-03-2017 01:16 PM)Vera Wrote:  I'm guessing what it means it that when them evil atheists lead a soul away from the path of righteousness, they are technically sending it straight to Hell. Or some such convoluted "logic".
Ah, that at least makes more sense (sense in the form of sounding like something that I would expect to hear from some Christians).

I love that quote at the bottom of your post! Thumbsup I may have to send that to a family member or two... Big Grin

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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03-03-2017, 01:40 PM
RE: Threats of damnation - "you're gonna go to hell"
Well, I guess they know best. They are church leaders, after all ... they know what's inside the mind of their god. Shy

Ok, right - Jesus (the reason there is a church) was apparently a jew. And yes, his sabbath would have been on a Saturday.

Consider

Well, there we are. Close the pool on Saturdays, too.
That way no trinities and/or denominations thereof, get god all pissed off. Shy

Just a side note...
I hear that Abrahamic god was a total dick when it cames to water sports on the sabbath. I think that was the last straw for jesus - the water walking trick was cute but hey, it was Saturday - he knew the rules!

That's some truth, right there. Drinking Beverage

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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